24 Feb 23
@sh76 saidYou really live in a Fantasy World. From September 1, 2020 to December31, 2020, the US had about 184,000 deaths from Covid which was only slightly less than the number that had died up to August 31 (193,000) or more than 5 months since the pandemic started killing in the US. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/
You're treating it as though it were a hypothetical "would have been."
Basically all of Europe had schools open in the Fall of 2020.
https://www.npr.org/2020/11/13/934153674/lessons-from-europe-where-cases-are-rising-but-schools-are-open
My kids were in camp from June 29, 2020 (which is the first day that King Andrew allowed it) and they were in school from the first n ...[text shortened]... ain because you were punning it to Full Metal Jacket, that was actually pretty clever, so nice job.)
24 Feb 23
@earl-of-trumps saidDo you ever read anything other than Breitbart?
https://www.breitbart.com
24 Feb 23
@no1marauder saidDifferent places got his on different schedules. Many places didn't really get their waves until late in the year.
You really live in a Fantasy World. From September 1, 2020 to December31, 2020, the US had about 184,000 deaths from Covid which was only slightly less than the number that had died up to August 31 (193,000) or more than 5 months since the pandemic started killing in the US. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/
In New York, we got socked in March through May, covid died to almost nothing in the summer and then spiked again in the winter, but it never again got as nearly as bad as it had in the Spring. that was my experience where I lived and it was yours as well, whether you want to admit it or not.
Schools opening in August and September (where they did) was not an inflection point and there were no discernable spikes happened right after schools opened. It was a long, slow climb as the weather cooled. And I don't recall neighborhoods where schools were open being hit any worse than where the public schools were closed.
Here, read the right wing rag, The Atlantic.
https://www.theatlantic.com/newsletters/archive/2022/10/pandemic-school-closures-americas-learning-loss/671868/
Or the Fox News Wannabe, USA Today
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/education/2023/01/30/a-problem-generation-covid-learning-loss/11148229002/
You can call me all the names you like. That won't change the fact that, while the majority was once with you, it's now with me, and in defending long term school closures, you'll soon be in the tiny fringe minority.
I know. I know. 10 billion flies. I get it.
24 Feb 23
@sh76 saidSince you know you've descended into nothing more than an Argumentum ad Populum and since you should know that's about as fallacious an argument as one can make, I probably should just leave it there. But it's even worse; it's an ex post facto Argumentum ad Populum, which is even stupider.
Different places got his on different schedules. Many places didn't really get their waves until late in the year.
In New York, we got socked in March through May, covid died to almost nothing in the summer and then spiked again in the winter, but it never again got as nearly as bad as it had in the Spring. that was my experience where I lived and it was yours as well, whethe ...[text shortened]... closures, you'll soon be in the tiny fringe minority.
I know. I know. 10 billion flies. I get it.
Most urban schools in NY didn't open for in school learning in Fall 2020, so the lack of a "spike" at that time proves nothing though there was a sharp rise in deaths in November and December. NY mostly followed wise policies regarding COVID relying on the advice of health experts which is why you didn't see sudden surges like happened in Florida after DeSantis suddenly removed almost all government measures in mid-2021.
Your failure to admit what you surely know i.e. if your policy preferences had been followed would have doomed many to sickness and quite a few to death is telling. None of the articles you mention even discuss that when they moan about the "costs" of schools relying mostly on virtual learning for the 2020 school year. They, like you, also commit the grave error of assuming that the pandemic itself wouldn't have affected learning; a deadly pandemic killing parents , grandparents, neighbors, etc. is not the normal situation all your arguments presume would have existed but for the temporary closing of in school learning.
So name calling isn't really necessary; the truth will do fine.
25 Feb 23
@sh76 saidData doesn't even support the "school closings caused the decline in test scores" even if we ignore the costs keeping in-person learning during a pandemic would have imposed (which you insist on doing):
Different places got his on different schedules. Many places didn't really get their waves until late in the year.
In New York, we got socked in March through May, covid died to almost nothing in the summer and then spiked again in the winter, but it never again got as nearly as bad as it had in the Spring. that was my experience where I lived and it was yours as well, whethe ...[text shortened]... closures, you'll soon be in the tiny fringe minority.
I know. I know. 10 billion flies. I get it.
"Similarly, when a recent Stanford study compared math achievement in different states, it found that declines in achievement came from many sources, and should not be solely attributed to learning modes. California, for example, had more school closures than any other state and some of the smallest declines in math achievement. Former California superintendent of the year Devin Vodicka has argued, convincingly, that any test score declines were a result of the emotional and economic hardship the pandemic caused students, not the change in learning mode."
https://hechingerreport.org/opinion-can-we-please-stop-talking-about-so-called-learning-loss/
The Vodicka article is quite eye opening:
" Looking at the data by state and by district shows a clear trend – there is no visual relationship between these variables, suggesting that the percentage of time spent in remote learning was not the determining factor for the decline in test scores."
"As we have seen over and over, test scores are clearly influenced by socio-economic status. The chart above is referencing tests in grades 3-8 and we see the same trends in other standardized tests such as the ACT which is used for college admissions.
If we know that income and test scores are highly related, what happened to income during the pandemic? Unsurprisingly, the data shows that income dropped “in all income tiers” with unemployment benefits serving as the key source of income for more than 10% of all adults, a figure which was double the number from the year before the pandemic.
All of this leads to a very common sense conclusion that the pandemic caused economic distress which led to a decline in test scores. "
https://learnercentered.org/are-we-asking-the-right-questions/
That logic seems impeccable.
25 Feb 23
1 edit
@sh76 saidWhile you don't want to discuss how much sickness and death would have been caused by fully reopening schools during Fall 2020 (and without any mask mandates "torturing" the kids), empirical studies have been made:
Different places got his on different schedules. Many places didn't really get their waves until late in the year.
In New York, we got socked in March through May, covid died to almost nothing in the summer and then spiked again in the winter, but it never again got as nearly as bad as it had in the Spring. that was my experience where I lived and it was yours as well, whethe ...[text shortened]... closures, you'll soon be in the tiny fringe minority.
I know. I know. 10 billion flies. I get it.
"This paper empirically examines how the opening of K–12 schools is associated with the spread of COVID-19 using county-level panel data in the United States. As preliminary evidence, our event-study analysis indicates that cases and deaths in counties with in-person or hybrid opening relative to those with remote opening substantially increased after the school opening date, especially for counties without any mask mandate for staff."
"The estimates indicate that fully opening K–12 schools with in-person learning is associated with a 5 (SE = 2) percentage points increase in the growth rate of cases. "
https://www.pnas.org/doi/10.1073/pnas.2103420118
A back of the envelope calculation suggests that this would have meant somewhere between 5,000 to 9,000 extra deaths in the Fall 2020 semester alone depending on how many schools were actually fully opened for in-school learning at the time (remember there were 184,000 COVID deaths from September 1, 2020 to December 31, 2020). This is, of course, without considering the added hospitalizations and cases where the sick person survived, but suffered long term health consequences.
So, how many points on standardized test scores would have been worth that cost even if we assume that the lack of in-person learning was fully responsible for the drop in test scores (which we know it was not)?
25 Feb 23
@jj-adams saidThat's almost amusing; if there's anything that shows up in the exit polls, it's that lower levels of educational achievement are correlated with Republican votes.
It's just like the movie Idiocracy.
Dems want everybody to be uneducated and stupid so they will keep voting for them.
Last year, white voters with no college degrees went more than 2 to 1 for Republican candidates i.e. 66% to 32%. By contrast, white voters with a college degree went 50% to 47% for Democrats. https://www.cnn.com/election/2022/exit-polls/national-results/house/0
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25 Feb 23
1 edit
@no1marauder saidThat's because white voters with college degrees have been brainwashed by our sick libtard institutions and professors.
That's almost amusing; if there's anything that shows up in the exit polls, it's that lower levels of educational achievement are correlated with Republican votes.
Last year, white voters with no college degrees went more than 2 to 1 for Republican candidates i.e. 66% to 32%. By contrast, white voters with a college degree went 50% to 47% for Democrats. https://www.cnn.com/election/2022/exit-polls/national-results/house/0
They probably watch The View and believe every word from Behar and Whoopie.
25 Feb 23
2 edits
@jj-adams saidDumber people like yourself are more easily brainwashed and gullible actually.
That's because white voters with college degrees have been brainwashed by our sick libtard institutions and professors.
They probably watch The View and believe every word from Behar and Whoopie.
Doubt AmRen readers tend to high levels of educational achievement.
You do realize you just contradicted yourself? Interestingly there was no difference in the percentage vote between POC with college degrees and without them in 2022 and only a very small difference of 2% in 2020.
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25 Feb 23
@no1marauder saidSo POC with college degrees voted the same as the uneducated POC who can barely read?
You do realize you just contradicted yourself? Interestingly there was no difference in the percentage vote between POC with college degrees and without them in 2022 and only a very small difference of 2% in 2020.
Wow.
That doesn't say much for them.
25 Feb 23
@jj-adams saidInteresting; you didn't say white voters without college degrees "can barely read".
So POC with college degrees voted the same as the uneducated POC who can barely read?
Wow.
That doesn't say much for them.
I wonder what causes someone to go on an internet chess site forum and daily post racist content.
25 Feb 23
@no1marauder saidI've never met a white person who couldn't read.
Interesting; you didn't say white voters without college degrees "can barely read".
I wonder what causes someone to go on an internet chess site forum and daily post racist content.
I've met "others" who couldn't read though.
25 Feb 23
@no1marauder saidWhat causes a so called Irishman to be anti white and pro black?
Interesting; you didn't say white voters without college degrees "can barely read".
I wonder what causes someone to go on an internet chess site forum and daily post racist content.
You definitely don't live in or near a major city.
25 Feb 23
@endlame saidOnly scumbag racists call anybody "anti-white."
What causes a so called Irishman to be anti white and pro black?
You definitely don't live in or near a major city.
I can't think of anything less important than skin pigmentation.