Debates
13 Jun 11
16 Jun 11
Originally posted by normbenignWithout the government, the corporate form wouldn't exist.
A corporation is legal fiction, creating a previously non-existent entity for the sole purpose of doing business. It accomplishes two basic purposes.
1. Limits legal liability for the corporation to corporate assets, making the risk of doing business more reasonable to investors.
2. Raising capital, so that a business may grow more quickly from "pote ...[text shortened]... voluntarily, no force applied by government, other than perhaps subsidies, or tax incentives.
16 Jun 11
Originally posted by AThousandYoungReally? In America, citizenship is automatic if you are born here, even if your parents are illegal. In other countries, citizenship can't be renounced, as in East Germany, or the Soviet Union.
Being a citizen is also voluntary. Nobody's forcing anybody to be part of any particular country.
What that has to do with corporate ownership, I don't know.
16 Jun 11
Originally posted by normbenignNo you didn't.
Did I not just say that?
You talked a lot about the "voluntary" nature of a corporation, but the fact is people are obliged by law to treat a corporation as something it is not i.e. a person. Moreover, if you are harmed by a corporation the individuals who own it can escape paying for all the harm done leaving you uncompensated at least in part.
This is enforced by governmental fiat i.e. ultimately force.
16 Jun 11
1 edit
Originally posted by normbenignOh, well that's true. Communist countries don't let you renounce citizenship. But in the USA, Europe, most countries for that matter - you can easily do so.
Really? In America, citizenship is automatic if you are born here, even if your parents are illegal. In other countries, citizenship can't be renounced, as in East Germany, or the Soviet Union.
What that has to do with corporate ownership, I don't know.
http://www.soros.org/initiatives/justice/focus/equality_citizenship/articles_publications/articles/stateless_20090401
Estimates of the current number of stateless persons in the world range from about 11 to 15 million
16 Jun 11
Originally posted by normbenignEast Germany and the Soviet Union don't exist anymore, moron.
Really? In America, citizenship is automatic if you are born here, even if your parents are illegal. In other countries, citizenship can't be renounced, as in East Germany, or the Soviet Union.
What that has to do with corporate ownership, I don't know.
16 Jun 11
Originally posted by no1marauderI said it is a legal fiction. That means created by the government. Moron.
No you didn't.
You talked a lot about the "voluntary" nature of a corporation, but the fact is people are obliged by law to treat a corporation as something it is not i.e. a person. Moreover, if you are harmed by a corporation the individuals who own it can escape paying for all the harm done leaving you uncompensated at least in part.
This is enforced by governmental fiat i.e. ultimately force.
16 Jun 11
Originally posted by no1marauderIn my original post, I gave the two justifications or rationales for government creating the corporation, its reason d'etre.
No you didn't.
You talked a lot about the "voluntary" nature of a corporation, but the fact is people are obliged by law to treat a corporation as something it is not i.e. a person. Moreover, if you are harmed by a corporation the individuals who own it can escape paying for all the harm done leaving you uncompensated at least in part.
This is enforced by governmental fiat i.e. ultimately force.
The corporation eases the difficulty in raising capital in two ways. It allows people to buy part ownership in the new concern, and encourages them to do so, by limiting their liability to what they have invested. Without limited liability, it is doubtful anyone in their right mind would ever invest in stock.
Good ideas, and some bad ones, get funded, and people make and lose money in the process. As far as inadequate compensation for those harmed, in more cases I find that people see tort law as a lottery system whereby they can get wealth of others, and often courts award far more than compensation to the alleged victims.
16 Jun 11
Originally posted by AThousandYoungThe point is that if you don't like it in America, nobody is forcing anyone to stay. Rather, with all its faults, America has more people trying to crash its borders than any other country.
Oh, well that's true. Communist countries don't let you renounce citizenship. But in the USA, Europe, most countries for that matter - you can easily do so.
http://www.soros.org/initiatives/justice/focus/equality_citizenship/articles_publications/articles/stateless_20090401
Estimates of the current number of stateless persons in the world range from about 11 to 15 million