@no1marauder said478 in 18 months is not that much different from flu. In the 2009-2010 flu season alone (a ~6 month period), there were 282 pediatric flu deaths. There were 179 in the 2018-2019 flu season.
The reality is at least 478 kids are dead and many more would be IF public officials followed the insane ideas of you and the other COVID deniers.
https://www.verywellhealth.com/deaths-from-flu-2633829
COVID is far more contagious than the flu, but infection-for-infection, flu is more dangerous for children than COVID.
@sh76 saidYour chart totals 1767 child flu deaths over 15 years or about 117.8 per year.
478 in 18 months is not that much different from flu. In the 2009-2010 flu season alone (a ~6 month period), there were 282 pediatric flu deaths. There were 179 in the 2018-2019 flu season.
https://www.verywellhealth.com/deaths-from-flu-2633829
COVID is far more contagious than the flu, but infection-for-infection, flu is more dangerous for children than COVID.
77 kids died from COVID in August and 280 so far this year (with September's report being fragmentary). https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm
Anyway, the discussion revolved around your claim that myocarditis might be more of a threat to the average 12 year old than the COVID vaccine. I already showed that to be nonsense.
@no1marauder saidYou didn't prove anything. You are relying on corrupted data. WE already know that deaths classified as caused by covid are not always caused by covid. Even hospitalizations are not necessarily because of covid. Many children are brought to the hospital for completely unrelated reasons and they are given a covid test and test positive. The kid dies from a mountain bike accident and it is counted as a covid related fatality.
Your chart totals 1767 child flu deaths over 15 years or about 117.8 per year.
77 kids died from COVID in August and 280 so far this year (with September's report being fragmentary). https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm
Anyway, the discussion revolved around your claim that myocarditis might be more of a threat to the average 12 year old than the COVID vaccine. I already showed that to be nonsense.
It is well known the covid fatality numbers are inflated. I created a thread about it. Remember?
03 Oct 21
@Metal-Brain
If anything the numbers are undercounted because people die who are alone and found much later.
03 Oct 21
@sonhouse saidNo.
@Metal-Brain
If anything the numbers are undercounted because people die who are alone and found much later.
Murder suicides are sometimes counted as covid deaths.
See my thread about covid deaths being inflated.
04 Oct 21
@Metal-Brain
Like I said, you never answered my question, so if the deaths right now are 710,000 and we are off overstating the deaths from covid by TEN THOUSAND, what does that mean for you?
It seems to me ALL you are interested in doing is weaponizing ANYTHING that will further your goal of overthrowing the US government and installing your 'soclialist' regime.
@no1marauder saidAs I have pointed out repeatedly, "children" are not a unitary block, and "vaccinated" is also not a binary choice ("immune" could mean previously infected, one dose, two doses, infection + one dose, etc.).
Your chart totals 1767 child flu deaths over 15 years or about 117.8 per year.
77 kids died from COVID in August and 280 so far this year (with September's report being fragmentary). https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm
Anyway, the discussion revolved around your claim that myocarditis might be more of a threat to the average 12 year old than the COVID vaccine. I already showed that to be nonsense.
You cannot compare "all children who get COVID" to "all children who get myocarditis." Vaccine-induced myocarditis appears to strike randomly (or at least there's no discernible pattern). COVID-induced serious illness overwhelmingly strikes children with serious comorbidities. So, to make the decision about whether it's more dangerous for a 12 year old to get vaccinated or exposed to SARS-CoV-2, you'd need to establish both cohorts of similarly situated children on a comorbidity level.
More importantly, your numbers don't differentiate between not previously infected, previously infected and single vaxxed. They'd all be considered not fully vaxxed for purposes of many of these studies, though some consider single vaxxed as vaccinated.
My "claim" was and only ever was that for a healthy 12 year old already infected with COVID, as second mRNA dose is probably more dangerous than being exposed to SARS-CoV-2. Nothing you have said even addresses this, let alone refutes it.
@sh76 saidPolicies regarding vaccinations to slow the spread of a deadly, contagious disease should not be based on such far fetched scenarios as you keep presenting.
As I have pointed out repeatedly, "children" are not a unitary block, and "vaccinated" is also not a binary choice ("immune" could mean previously infected, one dose, two doses, infection + one dose, etc.).
You cannot compare "all children who get COVID" to "all children who get myocarditis." Vaccine-induced myocarditis appears to strike randomly (or at least there's no disce ...[text shortened]... s than being exposed to SARS-CoV-2. Nothing you have said even addresses this, let alone refutes it.
Every person not vaccinated is an increased public health danger to others, a factor you seem to consistently ignore.
@no1marauder saidHow about we make a blanket exemption for those previously infected and testing positive for antibodies in the past 12 weeks? Is that a far-fetched scenario?
Policies regarding vaccinations to slow the spread of a deadly, contagious disease should not be based on such far fetched scenarios as you keep presenting.
Every person not vaccinated is an increased public health danger to others, a factor you seem to consistently ignore.
I think if you do that, you communicate that you're taking the science seriously and help re-establish some trust in the vax-hesitant. (That's what Israel does, by the way.) Blanket bans on people's access to restaurants because they "only" have natural immunity is irrational. I'm okay if private businesses want to do it on their own, but if government is going to do it, they need to do it in at least a rationally circumspect way.
05 Oct 21
@sh76 saidAccording to the CDC 'Evidence is emerging that people get better protection by being fully vaccinated compared with having had COVID-19. One study showed that unvaccinated people who already had COVID-19 are more than 2 times as likely than fully vaccinated people to get COVID-19 again."
How about we make a blanket exemption for those previously infected and testing positive for antibodies in the past 12 weeks? Is that a far-fetched scenario?
I think if you do that, you communicate that you're taking the science seriously and help re-establish some trust in the vax-hesitant. (That's what Israel does, by the way.) Blanket bans on people's access to restaurants ...[text shortened]... n, but if government is going to do it, they need to do it in at least a rationally circumspect way.
The sensible solution is not for non-experts to argue whether some people have enough protection without a vaccination. Instead get the vaccination or accept the ban from certain places.
05 Oct 21
@quackquack saidDo you have the underlying evidence? I'd really like to tease out whether they're comparing non-vaxed previously infected to vaxed, not previously infected (useful) or vaxed-undertermined whether previously infected vs. non-vaxed previously infected (useless).
According to the CDC 'Evidence is emerging that people get better protection by being fully vaccinated compared with having had COVID-19. One study showed that unvaccinated people who already had COVID-19 are more than 2 times as likely than fully vaccinated people to get COVID-19 again."
The sensible solution is not for non-experts to argue whether some people have en ...[text shortened]... otection without a vaccination. Instead get the vaccination or accept the ban from certain places.