Recently a Republican teen (Cayler Ellingson) was hit by a car and killed because of a political dispute.
For those of you who only consume left-wing news sites, likely you've not heard of this story, so here is a link for reference.
https://freebeacon.com/latest-news/man-who-killed-republican-teenager-over-political-argument-is-free-on-bail/
Since Biden keeps painting Republicans as dangerous extremists, does he share blame for this murder?
@techsouth saidNo Biden is not responsible unless he said that people should go out and run down people wearing maga hats.
Recently a Republican teen (Cayler Ellingson) was hit by a car and killed because of a political dispute.
For those of you who only consume left-wing news sites, likely you've not heard of this story, so here is a link for reference.
https://freebeacon.com/latest-news/man-who-killed-republican-teenager-over-political-argument-is-free-on-bail/
Since Biden keeps painting Republicans as dangerous extremists, does he share blame for this murder?
The perpetrator was / is a drunken idiot who be charged and tried for premeditated murder. Biden spoke / warned against the new potential for political motivated violence not in support of it.
But the right wing in particular needs to curb the tendency to disparage the opposition as traitors and enemies of the people something begun under trumps term in the whitehouse and continued by his acolytes in the GOP members of the press and more recently the FBI and DOJ have been singled out by the trump wing of the gop.
@kevcvs57 saidSo when the left criticizes the right, we are to focus our discussion on whether it is true or not. Nothing more.
No Biden is not responsible unless he said that people should go out and run down people wearing maga hats.
The perpetrator was / is a drunken idiot who be charged and tried for premeditated murder. Biden spoke / warned against the new potential for political motivated violence not in support of it.
But the right wing in particular needs to curb the tendency to disparage t ...[text shortened]... s of the press and more recently the FBI and DOJ have been singled out by the trump wing of the gop.
But when the right criticizes the left, we are to focus our discussion on what harm may come from saying such things. Nothing more.
Because the left already knows which accusations are true and which are false and have helpfully provided that information as a prerequisite for all future conversations.
@kevcvs57 saidDo you even know what a "double-standard" is? It doesn't seem like you've done much reflection in this area.
No Biden is not responsible unless he said that people should go out and run down people wearing maga hats.
The perpetrator was / is a drunken idiot who be charged and tried for premeditated murder. Biden spoke / warned against the new potential for political motivated violence not in support of it.
But the right wing in particular needs to curb the tendency to disparage t ...[text shortened]... s of the press and more recently the FBI and DOJ have been singled out by the trump wing of the gop.
@techsouth saidAt the very best, your argument is badly diluted.
Do you even know what a "double-standard" is? It doesn't seem like you've done much reflection in this area.
Someone who voted for Biden kills someone, Biden must be complicit.
And this should be put at the same level as someone taking a baseball bat to the Capitol.
Go sit in the corner.
@mghrn55 saidThis person not only voted for Biden, but he had been led to believe that he was dealing with a radical extremist who needed to be killed. That is the rhetoric from very prominent Democrats.
At the very best, your argument is badly diluted.
Someone who voted for Biden kills someone, Biden must be complicit.
And this should be put at the same level as someone taking a baseball bat to the Capitol.
Go sit in the corner.
Question. Had you even heard of this story before I posted it?
If not, consider that you might be getting your anecdotes with a large amount selection bias, not necessarily by your own intent.
If you had not heard this story before today, then you are hardly informed enough to trust your subjective judgement of who brings more violence.
@techsouth saidWhat *specific* words from Biden incited violence? Note you've failed to include such words.
This person not only voted for Biden, but he had been led to believe that he was dealing with a radical extremist who needed to be killed. That is the rhetoric from very prominent Democrats.
Question. Had you even heard of this story before I posted it?
If not, consider that you might be getting your anecdotes with a large amount selection bias, not necessarily by ...[text shortened]... then you are hardly informed enough to trust your subjective judgement of who brings more violence.
With Trump, specifics are given, like when he incited violence at his rallies by telling the crowd "knock the crap out of 'em" and offered to pay legal fees of anyone arrested for violence. Or Jan 6th, Trump's lapdog Giuliani said "let's have trial by combat".
These are specifics, which right-wingers fail to give because their arguments are often based on lies.
27 Sep 22
@vivify saidFirst, answer this question: had you heard of this news event before today? If not, don't you consider it an indication that your news sources are hiding things from you? And wouldn't that make it hard for you to make a subjective judgement on this topic?
It's simple: what specific words from Biden incited violence? Note you've failed to include such words.
With Trump, specifics are given, like when he incited violence at his rallies by telling the crowd "knock the crap out of 'em" and offering to pay legal fees of anyone arrested for violence. Or Jan 6th, Trump's lapdog Giuliani said "let's have trial by combat".
T ...[text shortened]... cifics[/i], which right-wingers always fail to give because their arguments are often based on lies.
The goal ought to be to judge by consistent standards.
Another goal would be to convey the facts accurately.
You've done neither.
Giuliani's words, in context, where clearly figurative. No honest adult can disagree.
Specifically Trump was referring to someone literally throwing objects at the speaker during a political rally. Don't you think that context matters? And how many times should Trump have to dodge projectiles before pushing back?
As far as paying legal fees, prominent Democrats have bailed out thousands of BLM and Antifa rioters, many of whom had committed violent acts. Trump offered to pay legal fees if someone did something in response to an object being thrown at the speaker during a rally. So far, I've heard of no one who he has had to bail out for violence. Have you? Wouldn't that be an important aspect of the conversation?
And don't forget Jan 6th. Trump says: "Please support our Capitol Police and Law Enforcement.... They are truly on the side of our Country. Stay peaceful".
And for that, since he also disputed the election and people were angry over that, he has been accused of inciting violence.
Let's review:
Biden's Words: "It's not just Trump, it's the entire philosophy that underpins the - I'm going to say something, it's like semi-fascism."
Also: "Donald Trump and the MAGA Republicans represent an extremism that threatens the very foundation of our republic."
If what Biden says is true, violence seems like it is very much called for, at least in the eyes of many many people.
(It seems more than certain that if Trump had said something comparable about Democrats he'd be accused of encouraging violence).
Trump's Words: "Please support our Capitol Police and Law Enforcement.... They are truly on the side of our Country. Stay peaceful"
In 2016: "If you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of them"
Earlier murder in addition to this one: https://www.voanews.com/a/usa_race-america_antifa-protester-implicated-killing-trump-supporter-oregon/6195248.html
My guess is left wing contributors to this forum have not heard of that event either.
27 Sep 22
@techsouth saidThe 140 police officers injured during the riot disagree.
Giuliani's words, in context, where clearly figurative. No honest adult can disagree.
And that was just a handful of endless examples:
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/10/us/politics/donald-trump-hillary-clinton.html
Donald Trump Suggests ‘Second Amendment People’ Could Act Against Hillary Clinton
That is a specific incitement to violence against a political opponent. Biden calling Trump fascist is not.
27 Sep 22
@techsouth saidNo. Probably because it's a non-story. No incitement to violence in anything you mentioned.
First, answer this question: had you heard of this news event before today?
27 Sep 22
@vivify saidHere is the first reply to this thread...
The 140 police officers injured during the riot disagree.
And that was just a handful of endless examples:
https://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/10/us/politics/donald-trump-hillary-clinton.html
Donald Trump Suggests ‘Second Amendment People’ Could Act Against Hillary Clinton
That is a specific incitement to violence against a political opponent. Biden calling Trump fascist is not.
No Biden is not responsible unless he said that people should go out and run down people wearing maga hats.
Trump did not call for violence on Jan 6th.
So it is clear the left will not use consistent standards.
27 Sep 22
@techsouth saidAs already mentioned, which you keep pretending you didn't see, nothing Biden said can even vaguely be interpreted as an incitement to violence. Trump saying "2nd Amendment people" can act against Hilary absolutely can.
Here is the first reply to this thread...
No Biden is not responsible unless he said that people should go out and run down people wearing maga hats.
Trump did not call for violence on Jan 6th.
So it is clear the left will not use consistent standards.
27 Sep 22
@vivify said"2nd amendment people" are people who want to uphold the 2nd amendment. If in your rules of evidence an advocate for the second amendment are necessarily going to use violence, then there can't be any valid way that you'd accept to defend the 2nd amendment.
As already mentioned, which you keep pretending you didn't see, nothing Biden said can even vaguely be interpreted as an incitement to violence. Trump saying "2nd Amendment people" can act against Hilary absolutely can.
I know of no violence that has been the result of that Tweet.
It seems clear that if the very fabric of our Democracy is at risk, many are going to believe that unethical means including violence are on the table. Painting someone as being "semi-fascists" because they have a simple difference of opinion on politics is despicable and is cranking up the temperature in a reckless manner.
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@techsouth saidHe sure does.
Since Biden keeps painting Republicans as dangerous extremists, does he share blame for this murder?
He has been hating on Republicans/Conservatives/White People for a long time and he should be removed from office for his hate mongering.
@techsouth saidNow you're being full it.
"2nd amendment people" are people who want to uphold the 2nd amendment. If in your rules of evidence an advocate for the second amendment are necessarily going to use violence, then there can't be any valid way that you'd accept to defend the 2nd amendment.
I know of no violence that has been the result of that Tweet.
It seems clear that if the very fabric of our Dem ...[text shortened]... erence of opinion on politics is despicable and is cranking up the temperature in a reckless manner.
It seems clear your intent is not to honestly discuss anything (not that anyone thought you trying to) but to slam Biden and defend Trump.
Biden called Trump fascist. That's all of you got. Nothing.