28 Apr 20
@eladar saidI don't think that's true. Rich people go to nursing homes too, albeit probably better ones.
No, rich people do not go to those nursing homes. Those nursing homes take in people without money on medicare.
Anyway, I'm certainly nowhere near the class of people who are too rich for nursing homes, so your dig is meaningless.
28 Apr 20
@joe-shmo saidPeople are understandably emotional about the source of the infection that has killed their relatives and rightly so. They will want to blame. The question is was the infection introduced by the hospital discharges or was it inevitably already there such that the home should have been barrier nursing to prevent between resident spread. The author of the article has clearly decided it was the discharges that were to blame and yet the article also suggests the virus had already arrived in one of the residents. In the U.K. the position has been that it is most likely already here so barrier nurse from the outset. Maybe the nursing approach in the homes was the problem rather than the discharges?
@petewxyz
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/amp/ncna1191811
This explains what was happening in more detail.
28 Apr 20
@eladar saidThere were plenty of beds, they never ran out. There was an empty ship available.
There were plenty of beds, they never ran out. There was an empty ship available.
So why not empty one nursing home, quarantine the healthy ones for a week or two in a empty facility, then move them into a different nursing home?
Use one facility for all covid patients.
Seems easy enough and logical. But no, they just sprinkled covid patients among multiple facilities ...[text shortened]...
You never answered my question, would you want your mother in a facility with covid patients in it?
=== In retrospect yes. They didn't know what would be the case at the time.
So why not empty one nursing home, quarantine the healthy ones for a week or two in a empty facility, then move them into a different nursing home?
=== I don't know if that was practical logistically, but if it could have been arranged, it would have been a good idea.
You never answered my question, would you want your mother in a facility with covid patients in it?
=== Ummm. No. I wouldn't either want her in a hospital with COVID patients. What's your point?
29 Apr 20
@earl-of-trumps saidWhat did Governor Cuomo say or do that prompts you to call him a "goon"?
And that goon governor they have, Cuomo, gets roaring approval from the plebes.
29 Apr 20
1 edit
@petewxyz saidHandyAndy posted the pdf of the relevant order on page 2, I've copied the URL below. It looks identical to what was done in the UK. I disagree with not testing them, the home needs to know whether the patient has covid-19 or not. But Nursing Homes cannot be allowed to refuse readmission, you can end up with fragile old people left homeless.
Not sure I understand what's going on here, but if it's the same as the U.K. this whole thread might be based on misunderstanding.
In the U.K. tests of Nursing Home residents revealed asymptomatic COVID positive residents already in the Nursing Homes, as might be expected given the high percentage of asymptomatic carriers. It was realised these Nursing Homes would have to ...[text shortened]... to take some of the pressure off hospital beds.
Sorry if that spoils the political football game.
https://coronavirus.health.ny.gov/system/files/documents/2020/03/doh_covid19-_nhadmissionsreadmissions_-032520.pdf
Edit: The relevant UK document is as follows and the relevant section is Annex D on page 13:
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/880274/Admission_and_Care_of_Residents_during_COVID-19_Incident_in_a_Care_Home.pdf
29 Apr 20
2 edits
@deepthought saidThe state would be responsible for the sick patient, so do as I said earlier.
HandyAndy posted the pdf of the relevant order on page 2, I've copied it below. It looks identical to what was done in the UK. I disagree with not testing them, the home needs to know whether the patient has covid-19 or not. But Nursing Homes cannot be allowed to refuse readmission, you can end up with fragile old people left homeless.
https://coronavirus.health.ny.gov/system/files/documents/2020/03/doh_covid19-_nhadmissionsreadmissions_-032520.pdf
The solution is easy enough.
Putting a potential covid source into a Nursing Home or throwing an elderly person on the street are not the only two options.
But it is likely the state did find a way to lower financial obligations by terminating the lives of the elderly.
29 Apr 20
@deepthought saidYou also have to put into the equation that the mortality for the very old always increases in hospitals due to falls in unfamiliar environments, increased night time confusion and exposure to secondary infections. If you add to that the realisation that the virus was already in the nursing homes due to the remarkable prevalence of asymptomatic carriers, the strategy has to be preventing between resident spread since it has already arrived. Stopping it at the front door is not a realistic strategy if there is evidence that ship has already sailed.
HandyAndy posted the pdf of the relevant order on page 2, I've copied the URL below. It looks identical to what was done in the UK. I disagree with not testing them, the home needs to know whether the patient has covid-19 or not. But Nursing Homes cannot be allowed to refuse readmission, you can end up with fragile old people left homeless.
https://coronavirus.healt ...[text shortened]... achment_data/file/880274/Admission_and_Care_of_Residents_during_COVID-19_Incident_in_a_Care_Home.pdf
29 Apr 20
@eladar saidBut but haven’t you stated that the elderly aren’t going to live much longer anyway and protecting them does not warrant a nationwide lockdown, or words to that effect. You really are a piece of work.
No support for endangering the lives of the elderly by No1?
29 Apr 20
@kevcvs57 saidI am for freedom. If you are free to move around and take care of yourself, then by all means do so.
But but haven’t you stated that the elderly aren’t going to live much longer anyway and protecting them does not warrant a nationwide lockdown, or words to that effect. You really are a piece of work.
If you are in an institution and cannot escape, then the responsible thing to do is protect these people.
But hey, given your upbringing and belief in your government leaders, such ideas as mine are totally out of line.