21 Nov 09
Originally posted by reinfeldso in other words...
reinfeld is open to those who love reason, those who admire freedom, those who give the religious their own place in the sun, those who love chess and when vera lynn sings they remember britain's finest hour ( the destruction of the nazi fourth reich )...also i like ufo investigators and those who listen to coast-to-coast radio...if you fit this profile send me a pm....
no, it's just you.
21 Nov 09
Originally posted by SuzianneTrue. They and she are sie. Formal you is Sie.
I thought "sie" can also mean "they"... (as well as "she" but you can isolate that via verb form) in addition to the formal "you" ("Sie" ). Since it was the beginning of the sentence, one can not tell if it is "Sie" or "sie".
There's probably a better way to express it.
21 Nov 09
2 edits
Originally posted by Green PaladinBecause I am able to set his antisemitism aside and am not entirely convinced all said about this topic is straightly true, simple bravado, writings to impress Cosima. Who knows? If the man was so rabidly antisemitic why was Der Ring des Nibelungen conducted by a Jewish conductor, Hermann Levi? This same conductor went on to conduct with great frequency at the Wagner Festspielhaus in Munich.
Why Wagner? The man was fiercely anti-Semitic.
Moreover, I admire the art more than the man, and Wagner was never, to my knowledge, involved in antisemitic acts, pogroms, or the crimes of the next century. Wagner is unfairly labeled as a philosophical protonazi. Yet he was indeed antisemitic. Yet his art was not.
Have you ever listened to the Ring. Have you failed to do so out of political correctness? You are missing out on one of humanity's greatest works of art! One of this era's best conductors, James Levine, is Jewish. If he seems to have no truck with Wagner why then neither do I! I also have many Jewish friends who love and admire Wagner for his music. One of my dearest friends gave me a record collection of Der Ring des Nibelungen in record form with libretto conducted by Karl Bohm. It is extraordinary. I counted myself lucky I found the same edition in CD form sans the libretto for only $25!
21 Nov 09
Originally posted by SuzianneI wouldn't have guessed that would seem strange to an english speaker? it's one of the most striking similarities between german and english after all. well, at least for one coming from a language that has totally different pronoun system.
I thought "sie" can also mean "they"... (as well as "she" but you can isolate that via verb form) in addition to the formal "you" ("Sie" ). Since it was the beginning of the sentence, one can not tell if it is "Sie" or "sie".
me, minä
you, sinä
he, hän
she, hän
we, me
you, te
they, he
+billions of different inflections for each of them depending on the context.
funnily enough, in eastern finnish 'you' is 'sie' instead of the western 'sinä'. without the silent 'e' of german 'sie' of course.
21 Nov 09
Originally posted by scacchipazzoI believe that wagner's nazi fame was more due to the nazis embracing his music, not his views on jews. he was a nationalist, but I understand his stand on the 'jewish problem' was that the jews should've been merged into german people, instead of segregating them.
Because I am able to set his antisemitism aside and am not entirely convinced all said about this topic is straightly true, simple bravado, writings to impress Cosima. Who knows? If the man was so rabidly antisemitic why was Der Ring des Nibelungen premiered by a Jewish conductor, Hans Richter? This same conductor went on to head the Wagner Festspielhau ...[text shortened]... ry. I counted myself lucky I found the same edition in CD form sans the libretto for only $25!
21 Nov 09
Originally posted by wormwoodYou are correct indeed! He was a favorite of the Nazis. Cannot hold this against the man. I posted a correction to my previous post. It was Hermann Levi, not Hans Richter who was Wagner favorite Jewish conductor and may hvae been present when Wagner died. Wagner did not do himself any favors by writing "Das Judenthum in der Musik". Wagner was also rather ungrateful and bit the hand of Giacomo Meyerbeer both in his article and excoritating the latter after Meyerbeer helped introduce one of Wagner's first operas. The man was an ass who created wonderful art!
I believe that wagner's nazi fame was more due to the nazis embracing his music, not his views on jews. he was a nationalist, but I understand his stand on the 'jewish problem' was that the jews should've been merged into german people, instead of segregating them.
22 Nov 09
Originally posted by scacchipazzoI imagine the Nazis thought they were being "artistic" when they made decorative lampshades out of the tanned skin of Jews as well. Are you able to put their antisemitism and whatever revulsion you might feel aside and appreciate their work for its artistic value alone? How about the gas chambers themselves? From an engineering standpoint they were remarkably effcient and artistic in their own right. Surely a finely engineered system has a certain.. je ne sais quoi... poetry about it?
Because I am able to set his antisemitism aside and am not entirely convinced all said about this topic is straightly true, simple bravado, writings to impress Cosima. Who knows? If the man was so rabidly antisemitic why was Der Ring des Nibelungen conducted by a Jewish conductor, Hermann Levi? This same conductor went on to conduct with great frequency ...[text shortened]... ry. I counted myself lucky I found the same edition in CD form sans the libretto for only $25!
Wagner was, as is supported by his own writings, an unrepentant antisemite. You can dress up a pig and spray it with flowery scents, but, it remains a pig. Wagner was a pig.
22 Nov 09
Originally posted by Hand of HecateAnd it is for this exact reason that I never play the Poisoned Pawn Variation of the Najdorf Sicilian because Bobby Fischer loved it and he was an anti-semite.
I imagine the Nazis thought they were being "artistic" when they made decorative lampshades out of the tanned skin of Jews as well. Are you able to put their antisemitism and whatever revulsion you might feel aside and appreciate their work for its artistic value alone? How about the gas chambers themselves? From an engineering standpoint they were ...[text shortened]... can dress up a pig and spray it with flowery scents, but, it remains a pig. Wagner was a pig.