31 Mar 06
1 edit
Originally posted by Nordlys
No, but the passengers who happen to be on that flight would be unlucky.
If you were one of the passengers and were seriously injured, would you accept an explanation of "you were unlucky"? Or would you want compensation for the error made? I wouldn't accept it as just bad luck. Somebody caused it to happen. Bad luck for me would involve something like a natural disaster and not human error.
31 Mar 06
Originally posted by NordlysSo with that reasoning, if my opponent is drunk then I'm lucky. But what if I outplay them in a given opening, aren't I also lucky that they didn't prepare themselves better in this respect too?
Likewise, if my opponent makes a blunder because he isn't fully awake or she is drunk, my opponent isn't unlucky, but has him-/herself to blame, but I am lucky.
31 Mar 06
Originally posted by VarenkaI think there is luck in chess. If I make a move that has some benefits that I didn't see at the time I made the move, then I would call that luck.
Do you think luck exists in chess?
I guess that this largely depends on what you define to be luck. I personally think of luck in terms of elements outwith any of the players' control, e.g. the roll of a dice or how the cards are dealt in other games.
So, for me, chess has no luck involved. But I do acknowledge that a lot of players, including GMs, will say "I was lucky", etc. I wonder how they define luck in chess?!
Thoughts?
There may be 10 possible moves at any given time, but only one "good" move. Even a beginner can make the "good" move from time to time, whether he has any idea why or not. That is luck.
Luck in chess though is different than luck in poker or craps. Any time you make a move that benefits you sometime in the future, it is at least *plausible* that you did it on purpose and knew what you were doing. Thus observers and opponents, especially at higher levels of play, cannot blithely dismiss your play as luck. Nevertheless, if I feel I got lucky, I have no problem admitting it.
31 Mar 06
You left out the human element. Touching a piece that you did not want to play and having to play it. The droping of a piece in the wrong square and having to play the resulting position. There are other things that can effect the game. There is the element of luck in the game.
31 Mar 06
Originally posted by techsouthIt's a debatable point, hence my reason for mentioning it.
I think there is luck in chess. If I make a move that has some benefits that I didn't see at the time I made the move, then I would call that luck.
On this note, I've read a fair bit about the role of our subconscious mind and intuition while playing chess. I'm sure others have too.
E.g., sometimes we feel that a sacrifice is right, but can't give any concrete winning lines prior to playing it. Then we play it, and later it turns out that we were correct. So, is this luck? I don't regard it as luck, but yet the benefits couldn't be fully seen at the outset.
31 Mar 06
Originally posted by WulebgrWas she reading out loud or did the subject of the book bother you?
I lost a critical game (from a superior position) while my opponent's wife was sitting in the room reading a book on witchcraft. Was my blunder "luck" for my opponent. I don't think so, and I worked to have his wife banned from the playing room in all future tournaments.
31 Mar 06
1 edit
Originally posted by VarenkaI guess we see luck or bad luck differently. For me, being unlucky doesn't exclude the possibility that there's someone to blame. To me, "you were unlucky" is not an explanation, it's just a statement. If I had been on a different airplane, I wouldn't have been injured, so being on that specific airplane was bad luck. If airplanes would crash all the time, I wouldn't call it bad luck, as it would have been expected. So for me it's not about causes (as long as the cause is out of my control), but rather about likelihood.
Originally posted by Nordlys
No, but the passengers who happen to be on that flight would be unlucky.
If you were one of the passengers and were seriously injured, would you accept an explanation of "you were unlucky"? Or would you want compensation for the error made? I wouldn't accept it as just bad luck. Somebody caused it to happen. Bad luck for me would involve something like a natural disaster and not human error.
31 Mar 06
Originally posted by VarenkaAgain, for me it's a question about what you could expect. If you outplay your opponent because you are a stronger player, I wouldn't call it luck (although in a tournament it might be luck that you were paired with that player). If you play someone who always plays worse than you because he's always drunk when playing, I wouldn't call it luck either. If your opponent has about the same playing strength and could be expected to prepare, but he doesn't for some reason, then I would say you were lucky.
So with that reasoning, if my opponent is drunk then I'm lucky. But what if I outplay them in a given opening, aren't I also lucky that they didn't prepare themselves better in this respect too?
31 Mar 06
Originally posted by richjohnsonNice one :-)
Indeed
User 22093
As I mentioned in my initial post, a person's interpretation of the work "luck" is a main factor to answering the question.
Thanks to everyone for their opinions.
31 Mar 06
I was playing a game in a tournament once, which I needed to win. Before the draw for that round had been made, I went to the bookstall, and browsed through a book, to see if it covered anything more than my current book on the opening I was playing at the time. In fact, it went a couple of moves deeper than the book I had, and showed how to punish a dubious move by black in that position, which I would not have seen. I decided to purchase the book after the tournament if I won the grading prize. That round, I got the exact position I had seen in this book, my opponent played the dubious move, i remembered the refutation I had seen, and I won.
I'd say that's pretty much luck on my part!