20 Jun 06
1 edit
Originally posted by BigDoggProblemIt would not be my mistake if another person started comenting on my games. They can also do this without me posting a link to one of my games in the forums. Everyone is responible for their own behaviour.
Who walks into a room full of chessplayers, shows them a game, and does not expect to receive any comments about it?
What if someone had found a flaw in your 'forced mate' and posted their analysis here? Would you then use that information in your game? If not, would you deliberately play an inferior or even losing line, to avoid making use of the third-party help? How do you escape this dilemma?
20 Jun 06
1 edit
Originally posted by LordOfTheChessboard"Everyone is responible for their own behaviour."
It would not be my mistake if another person started comenting on my games. They can also do this without me posting a link to one of my games in the forums. Everyone is responible for their own behaviour.
Except you, apparently!
20 Jun 06
1 edit
Originally posted by LordOfTheChessboardYou never answered the question. Let's say that someone here found that your forced mate was flawed, and in fact, Black ends up winning instead, if that line is played. Would you play your intended continuation anyway and lose, or change it in light of the third party analysis? It's an unenviable situation: You must either deliberately lose, or cheat. So, show us how you'll take responsibility for your behavior in this situation.
It would not be my mistake if another person started comenting on my games. They can also do this without me posting a link to one of my games in the forums. Everyone is responible for their own behaviour.
"They can also do this without me posting a link to one of my games in the forums."
What are the odds that they will randomly pick your game out of all the games on this server, and comment on it?
20 Jun 06
Originally posted by BigDoggProblemActually Big Dog, the scenario you describe is almost exactly what happened. The original post asks us to find a forced mate from move 11 or 12.
You never answered the question. Let's say that someone here found that your forced mate was flawed, and in fact, Black ends up winning instead, if that line is played. Would you play your intended continuation anyway and lose, or change it in light of the third party analysis? It's an unenviable situation: You must either deliberately lose, or cheat. ...[text shortened]... t they will randomly pick your game out of all the games on this server, and comment on it?
There wasn't a forced mate from move 11 or 12.
When some one pointed that out to LOTC he tried to prove that there was a mate and played a line that blundered the win away!
21 Jun 06
Couldn't TOS be extended with a rule 3d or something:
"Do not refer or comment on any game in progress in any contact, such as in forum, mail or otherwise, with other members in RHP."
Most of us obey this rule, and understand the meaning and reason of it. Why not put this unwritten rule in writing. Then the problem is solved and this kind of threads will not exist anymore.
21 Jun 06
Originally posted by LordOfTheChessboardso, you don't mind if we all start commenting on every single one of your on going games?
It would not be my mistake if another person started comenting on my games. They can also do this without me posting a link to one of my games in the forums. Everyone is responible for their own behaviour.
"look, LOTC hung a piece"
"oh no, a forced mate"
"now he dropped a rook to a combination"
"sac'ing an exchange here is winning"
"there's a won endgame ahead if he simplifies"
"that attack is premature"
or just a simple "oh dear 🙄" every time you make a mistake.
24 Jun 06
1 edit
Originally posted by BigDoggProblemOf course the person commenting on my game in progress would be violating the TOS. - His fault.
You never answered the question. Let's say that someone here found that your forced mate was flawed, and in fact, Black ends up winning instead, if that line is played. Would you play your intended continuation anyway and lose, or change it in light of the third party analysis? It's an unenviable situation: You must either deliberately lose, or cheat. t they will randomly pick your game out of all the games on this server, and comment on it?
24 Jun 06
Originally posted by wormwoodOf course not, I make more then enough blunders like every chess player. If you like to comment on them to raise your own self-esteem go right ahead. If it makes you feel good I'll even post a link: Game 1497510
so, you don't mind if we all start commenting on every single one of your on going games?
"look, LOTC hung a piece"
"oh no, a forced mate"
"now he dropped a rook to a combination"
"sac'ing an exchange here is winning"
"there's a won endgame ahead if he simplifies"
"that attack is premature"
or just a simple "oh dear 🙄" every time you make a mistake.
28 Jun 06
Originally posted by BigDoggProblemOh, this is good!
Ok, so he's at fault. Meanwhile, what do you do about your game? If you use his advice, you're now at fault too.
If it is legal to give an advice (TOS 3b doesn't clearly forbid it), just to take help from it (TOS says that you can't consult any third party to assist you) - this is the answer to all prayers when your have a mate in the next move:
You just tell him that "You have a mate in next move! Why don't you mate me?"
I can advice him but he cannot use the advice without beeing banned by the rule 3b!
Yeah!!!
28 Jun 06
Originally posted by BigDoggProblemYes but how are you going to know if I used the advice? I could have come up with the variations myself. So the only thing we do know for sure is that the the person who started commenting on the game was at fault.
Ok, so he's at fault. Meanwhile, what do you do about your game? If you use his advice, you're now at fault too.
So now we see that there is actually nothing wrong with the TOS and that it fits togeter perfectly. (if everyone abides by the rules)
28 Jun 06
Originally posted by LordOfTheChessboardConsidering you gave a losing line as winning earlier I'd say it's safe to say that you wouldn't have seen it.
Yes but how are you going to know if I used the advice? I could have come up with the variations myself. So the only thing we do know for sure is that the the person who started commenting on the game was at fault.
So now we see that there is actually nothing wrong with the TOS and that it fits togeter perfectly. (if everyone abides by the rules)
28 Jun 06
1 edit
Originally posted by XanthosNZI am sure you're a much better chess player then me Xanthos, I never doubted that.
Considering you gave a losing line as winning earlier I'd say it's safe to say that you wouldn't have seen it.
But what if you where in my shoes, you would have surely seen the winning line as well, what then?
28 Jun 06
Originally posted by LordOfTheChessboardLet's say that somehow one of my in progress games got posted (by someone else I guess as I wouldn't do it) and someone posted a winning line in one and I saw it before the mods got to it. So that's the situation.
I am sure you're a much better chess player then me Xanthos, I never doubted that.
But what if you where in my shoes, you would have surely seen the winning line as well, what then?
The situation is analogous to a watcher at an OTB tournament giving a winning line within hearing of the players. The tournament arbiter can kick out the idiot but he can't change what the players heard. He can't the player who could have benefited either (because then someone with a vested interest in the game could cause a player to be penalised through no fault of the player).
28 Jun 06
Originally posted by LordOfTheChessboardWe can prove, in this scenario, that you did use moves that were suggested by someone else, which is strong evidence of 3rd party assistance. You, on the other hand, have no evidence to suggest you intended to play those moves before they were given to you. In fact, in the scenario I gave, another user refutes your planned winning line, showing it to be winning for the other side. Accepting that help is totally unethical, whether you get caught for it, or not.
Yes but how are you going to know if I used the advice? I could have come up with the variations myself. So the only thing we do know for sure is that the the person who started commenting on the game was at fault.
So now we see that there is actually nothing wrong with the TOS and that it fits togeter perfectly. (if everyone abides by the rules)