25 Aug 07
Originally posted by BLReidI think I have sorted them out.
These are very basic endgame situations. If you can't sort them out, then try to find an online resource or get an endgame book. You just reminded me of why lower rated players often don't resign lost positions, or accept draw offers in unwinable positions...because they don't realize that they are lost or drawn.
Are you saying that there is a position for K-p verse K-Q that does not result in a win for K-Q?
I admit I have no formal training, have not played in 20 years, and I am just learning. But I find your attitude offensive. I find these exercises interesting. But is often difficult to get a straight answer in forums because of your type of answers.
25 Aug 07
1 edit
Originally posted by 8DIf you find anything offensive, then that is your problem. I already explained why a Bishop pawn on the 7th rank can draw, scroll to my first post on page 1 of this thread. I gave a straight answer, and if you were too lazy to read it, that doesn't entitle you to launch an attack against me, particularly after I defended you in another thread. There was nothing rude in my comments, and I suggest that you go over my posts again as slowly as you need to to understand them.
I think I have sorted them out.
Are you saying that there is a position for K-p verse K-Q that does not result in a win for K-Q?
I admit I have no formal training, have not played in 20 years, and I am just learning. But I find your attitude offensive. I find these exercises interesting. But is often difficult to get a straight answer in forums because of your type of answers.
25 Aug 07
Originally posted by BLReidYes. I see it now. I apologize for my outburst.
If you find anything offensive, then that is your problem. I already explained why a Bishop pawn on the 7th rank can draw, scroll to my first post on page 1 of this thread. I gave a straight answer, and if you were too lazy to read it, that doesn't entitle you to launch an attack against me, particularly after I defended you in another thread. There was nothi ...[text shortened]... nts, and I suggest that you go over my posts again as slowly as you need to to understand them.
I guess I get frustrated because there is some much to learn and so little time to do it in.
I have not belonged to any OTB clubs where I suspect the person to person contact probably helps rip through these simpler problems.
But the truth is, until you figure it out yourself it is far from simple.
K-R, mate seems basic to me but some may not see it so clear. I would have guessed that the K-Q would always be a win but now I see the exception.
25 Aug 07
1 edit
Apology accepted. Here is an example of a QvsRook Pawn that is a draw with White to move. Go to shredderchess.com and follow the links to the online tablebase so you can play out the position from the Black side. just make sure to always make the top move on the list for the White side and you will soon see that the game is a draw.
25 Aug 07
2 edits
And here is an example of a position where a Bishop pawn draws against a Queen, again, White to move.
You can find the endgame tablebase here:
http://www.shredderchess.com/online-chess/online-databases/endgame-database.html
It is useful for learning and practice, but you cannot refer to it in your games.
25 Aug 07
Originally posted by BLReidThese are exception but, as a general rule the K&Q vs K&P will be a win for the stronger side, even with the pawn on the 7th.
And here is an example of a position where a Bishop pawn draws against a Queen, again, White to move.
[fen]8/5P2/3K4/8/8/1k6/8/q7 w - - 0 1[/fen]
You can find the endgame tablebase here:
http://www.shredderchess.com/online-chess/online-databases/endgame-database.html
It is useful for learning and practice, but you cannot refer to it in your games.
Virtually every ending has some sort of exception where the psotion of the pieces is favorable for the weaker side. Often the resource in such situations is stalemate.
You are of course correct in pointing it out as a prerequisite to winning the ending is to know how to avoid the drawn positions.
26 Aug 07
By the way, because someone asked - the reason why a bishop pawn often draws on the 7th rank while a knight pawn is still a win for the stronger side is rather simple. With the bishop pawn - say, a pawn on f7 - the weaker side can walk away from the pawn with Kh8! If the stronger side captures with Qxf7, this causes a stalemate.
Of course, if the stronger side's king is near the action, this can often change the result from a draw to a win.
26 Aug 07
Originally posted by BLReidThanks for the site. It is really cool.
Apology accepted. Here is an example of a QvsRook Pawn that is a draw with White to move. Go to shredderchess.com and follow the links to the online tablebase so you can play out the position from the Black side. just make sure to always make the top move on the list for the White side and you will soon see that the game is a draw.
[fen]8/5K1P/8/8/3q4/8/8/2k5 w - - 0 1[/fen]
That is one of the problems of working through end games, is that I work both sides and it is difficult not to work to your assumptions. That site really helps you with that issue.
It appears you can set up any type of end game problem.
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27 Aug 07
Originally posted by MoneyMaker7check your facts.
Any pawn on the sixth rank is drawn. Rook pawns are drawn because of stalemate, and bishop pawns are drawn because of stalemate also.
The trick is to check the king in front of the pawn so your king has a free move to inch closer, then repeat the process. When your king gets close enough, inside a "box" then you can simply allow your opponent to queen ...[text shortened]... h your king and queen.
Anyone with the slightest endgame knowledge shoulda figured that out