Originally posted by GolubI agree, controlling the d5 square is often a part of whites plan. Also, it severely hampers blacks light bishop! 1.d4 Nf6 - the reason here for Nf6 is to stop 2.e4; 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 (attacking d5) e6 (defending d5) you see?
You are totally missing the point. White can play 4. d5 (this is the threat).
So, fianchettoing the bishop too early is bad if it allows white to play d5. Some black defences are aimed at allowing white to take d5, but in the case of such a plan, black never fianchettos the bishop.
I hope that helped some.
Also, the nimzo indian is characterized by the moves 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nc3 Bb4
Move 3 is the defining move because other third moves have other names. 3...c5 for example
Originally posted by ChessJesterThere's a difference between controlling d5 and occupying d5. To control d5 with a pawn, White would need a pawn at c4 and/or e4. White gets c4 on move 2, but Black fights for e4 by pinning the knight on c3.
I agree, controlling the d5 square is often a part of whites plan. Also, it severely hampers blacks light bishop! 1.d4 Nf6 - the reason here for Nf6 is to stop 2.e4; 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 (attacking d5) e6 (defending d5) you see?
Black's e6 allows him to develop his kingside bishop to b4, which is more to the point than preventing White playing d5.
I think white still has the opening advantage since he gets the centre. The point of the QID is that white does not threaten an immidiate e4, which gives black a little extra time. But if white does threaten e4, he threatens to take the centre, and you shouldn't have that extra time as black. Of course, there is a lot of play left. Both g6 and b5 are probably too slow, at a first glance.
Originally posted by GolubRemember that openings such as the Nimzo, KID, Grunfeld, Alekhine's, etc. often allow White to build up a centre for it then to be attacked. So I'm not convinced that White "gets the centre" by playing d5. He may be overstretching slightly; plus it costs him a move that could be spend on development (e.g. Nf3).
I think white still has the opening advantage since he gets the centre.
If 4.d5 then 4... e6 attacking White's centre. I think the position is equal.
After the moves 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3, Black can play b6 and Bb7 with control of the e4 square for a long time. White may eventually gain control of the e4 square, but not without making a concession of some sort e.g. exchanging white squared bishops.
I think the way to gain an advantage against 1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 b6 3.Nc3 Bb7 is to continue with 4.Qc2 and if 4...e6 then 5.e4 Bb4 6.f3
Originally posted by !~TONY~!I guess that makes sence... I see now why Qc2 is sometimes played after Bb4
I think the reason this isn't played alot is simply because White has the option of 4. f3, and then 5. e4, or something like this. Black will probably end up playing 4..e6 and 5..Bb4 and end up being in an inferior 4. f3 Nimzo Indian.