19 Jun 06
Originally posted by XanthosNZso, tell me then, and please no amiguity.
Once again, you do not have to move three times in a row. You could move once every day even if you are playing a line the opponent has preloaded.
How do you stop this function being used as a way of saving people time in hardcore games, or games with small timeouts?
How do you make sure the function is only used when there is only one possible line , and not as an " if a=x, then let b = y" ?
19 Jun 06
Originally posted by huckleberryhoundBy allowing only one branch to be preloaded.
so, tell me then, and please no amiguity.
How do you stop this function being used as a way of saving people time in hardcore games, or games with small timeouts?
How do you make sure the function is only used when there is only one possible line , and not as an " if a=x, then let b = y" ?
So it wouldn't be very useful in situations where you weren't sure of the next move. However you could use it when the opponent's move will be a forced recapture or you know what it will be for some other reason.
19 Jun 06
Originally posted by XanthosNZlook, i can understand how this could be used when the position is hopeless, and there is only one way to proceed, but the site cant be programmed to identify this.
By allowing only one branch to be preloaded.
So it wouldn't be very useful in situations where you weren't sure of the next move. However you could use it when the opponent's move will be a forced recapture or you know what it will be for some other reason.
This is an over simplified example of my point.
My point about "if a=x let b=y" is that when a game begins, i could play e4 for example. Then preload the next two moves by guessing the opponent would play e5, then move his knight (which in low rated games is not unusual). If, however the other guy offers queens gambit (hope i got that right), the game will show up "your move", but if he plays my choice then i can leave the game unattended. If he is playing against the standard opening he can therefor leave the game unattended for 9 days (assuming the game is 3/7, and the opponent moves only once every three days).
now put this into a hardcore game, or a 1/na game and theres unfair advantages to be had for someone who has the time to master the technique, like preloading three possible moves every time he has to make a move manually.
change for change's sake is not always the right option.
19 Jun 06
Originally posted by huckleberryhoundYeah nice going talking about Queen's Gambit after 1. e4.
look, i can understand how this could be used when the position is hopeless, and there is only one way to proceed, but the site cant be programmed to identify this.
This is an over simplified example of my point.
My point about "if a=x let b=y" is that when a game begins, i could play e4 for example. Then preload the next two moves by guessing t ...[text shortened]... he has to make a move manually.
change for change's sake is not always the right option.
So wait, a player has the possibility to be able to leave the game for 9 days assuming that 1) he knows exactly which opening his opponent will play (possible if they've played before), 2) The opponent waits as long as possible between opening moves, 3) The opponent doesn't preload his opening moves too.
I mean if you play 1. e4 and preload 'if e5 then Nf3 and then if Nc6 then Bc4' based on the fact that opponent always plays the open game then your opponent could quite easily play e5 and load 'if Nf3 then Nc6 and then if Bc4 then Bc5' knowing that you always play the Italian Game. All they would need to do is look at your previous games. If they are too lazy to do so then that's their problem. Why should we cater to the lazy ones? If they did so then the first player would get back the game very quickly with him to play. It would be a godsend for times when I've had 20 or more games start up at once (large group tournaments or leagues). Do you know how tedious it is playing the same move twenty times?
This would in theory allow people who vary their openings to counter players looking at their past games to work out what they will play. Of course those players already enjoy that advantage as players can't book up on the relevant openings beforehand.
You claim that players who use the premove interface to their advantage will have an advantage over those who don't. But surely that is their prerogative. Database use is allowed here, those that choose not to use them (for whatever reason) are putting themselves at a disadvantage verses those who do. Should we ban database use by the same logic?
Change for Change's sake is not the right option however keeping the status quo because it's familiar isn't either.
19 Jun 06
Originally posted by huckleberryhoundYes, and maybe someone who understands how this idea might work (even though I originally thought it would not). There is no problem having an opinion that differs except you aren't listening to what others are stating.
another one of xanthos's clan buddies, i see.
How dare i have an opinion that differs from yours.You's guys really are something, you know that.
and one other thing. russ's statement was "its on my to do list", i'm sure ridding the world of hunger, and meeting Iron Maiden are on his to do list aswell.
Also, how do you know Russ wants to rid the world of hunger and meet Iron Maiden. These are valid goals, but not necessarily what an individual actually seeks. Russ has stated that it is on his to do list, and it is pretty rude for you to say that it is a meaningless list anyway.
19 Jun 06
Originally posted by Gastelget a life
Yes, and maybe someone who understands how this idea might work (even though I originally thought it would not). There is no problem having an opinion that differs except you aren't listening to what others are stating.
Also, how do you know Russ wants to rid the world of hunger and meet Iron Maiden. These are valid goals, but not necessarily what an ind ...[text shortened]... s on his to do list, and it is pretty rude for you to say that it is a meaningless list anyway.
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22 Jun 06
Regarding the pre-move idea, how do you all feel about this issue about the feature.
Is the premove line designated unchangeable as long as your opponent follows your listed line?
Example:
A game is started, I play the bird and the most common response is 1..d5, so lets say I put in the following line:
1. f4
IF: 1..d5 THEN 2. Nf3
IF: 2..c5 THEN 3. e3
IF: 3..Nc6 THEN 4.Bb5
IF: 4..Bd7 THEN 5.c4
Now lets say that my opponent makes the first 3 moves, but then stops moving for a couple days. Should I be able to CANCEL my predefined fifth move? As long as I cancel it before they make their fourth? OR should I be stuck with 5.c4 as long as they 4..Bd7 ?
I think a RHP-competitor's site that has the premove feature required. IF you predefine the line, it can't be cancelled until your opponent varies from the line.
Personally, i think you should be able to cancel your pre-defined line at any move as long as you do so BEFORE they make the previous move. But I think this is different from traditional correspondence email rules/standards.
Does that make sense any opinions?
22 Jun 06
Originally posted by tmetzlerI can't see any reason not to allow changing of your premove up until the time it is enacted. Just the same as game notes really.
Regarding the pre-move idea, how do you all feel about this issue about the feature.
Is the premove line designated unchangeable as long as your opponent follows your listed line?
Example:
A game is started, I play the bird and the most common response is 1..d5, so lets say I put in the following line:
1. f4
IF: 1..d5 THEN 2. Nf3
IF: 2..c5 THEN ...[text shortened]... t from traditional correspondence email rules/standards.
Does that make sense any opinions?
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22 Jun 06
Originally posted by XanthosNZMe neither except it is different than how traditional correspondence chess works.
I can't see any reason not to allow changing of your premove up until the time it is enacted. Just the same as game notes really.
also, should your opponent be able to see your predefined moves?
This is also something your opponent can obviously see in traditional correspondence chess.
22 Jun 06
One question is whether this site is intended to replicate traditional correspondence chess digitally, or to extend traditional correspondence chess from where it was once.
Personally, I don't mind it either way (showing the moves or not). I think lower rated players might see the value in analyzing their opponent's moves before they happen and high rated players are not going to be surprised (likely) by an opponent's opening.
22 Jun 06
Originally posted by tmetzlerI envision that your opponent can see that you have a premove prepared but not what it is or what it is in response to.
Me neither except it is different than how traditional correspondence chess works.
also, should your opponent be able to see your predefined moves?
This is also something your opponent can obviously see in traditional correspondence chess.
I wouldn't have a problem using premoves if all information was visible to the opponent either though. It wouldn't matter in the prime times for using them (forced moves and opening).