Disinformation

Originally posted by Suzianne to twhitehead
I'm usually surprised when I read your posts in the Debates forum, because I generally agree with them, and I see that you're capable of writing opinions about other people without bias.

Wait. So whether something is 'biased' depends on whether or not you agree with it ~ is that what you mean?

Originally posted by Suzianne
Okay, have it your way. I'm bigoted against Republicans.

I dare you to claim that this rises to the same level of abhorrent, ignorant bigotry shown by KKK members against blacks, Nazis against Jews, Christians against Muslims, or even atheists against Christians.

I claim no such thing. I was surprised by the definition myself, but then it doesn't really cover the full range of the words meaning.

Merriam Webster does better:
a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices; especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

Originally posted by Suzianne
I've read a rather large number of your posts in this forum, and I've seen your bias against Christians many times.

Yes, I am biased against Christians. But that does not mean that my bias against you is because you are Christian, nor does it mean anything I said to you in this thread had anything to do with you being a Christian.

You know what they say about something if it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck and sounds like a duck, it's probably a duck.
And that sort of thinking is what leads to bigotry and the sort of disinformation found in the OP.

But then again, this is precisely why I haven't brought this up before now.
You bring it up all the time (your belief that I am unfairly biased towards you). You have a quite serious persecution complex and read 'attack' into my posts even when it isn't there. I thought it interesting to compare religion such as Islam to political views such as communism and you immediately jumped to the false conclusion that I believed you were anti-communist and was attacking you. If you go back and reread my posts in a less defensive manner you will see that it was all in your mind.

Originally posted by FMF
Offering stereotypes about a large diverse group of people is unjustifiable in part because it doesn't "let any facts get in the way", as she put it, and it can therefore constitute disinformation, except in so far as it pertains to the nature of her bias. But anyway, in this instance it's moot as she has conceded that she's bigoted against Republicans.

I did not concede anything. I said, "Okay, have it your way." Trying to head off your incessant interrogation is not conceding. I'm merely acknowledging that IF your definition is what you base your assertion on, then your assertion may be true. Your definitions are hardly ever correct, just as you often strive to put words in my mouth and then ask me if that's what I mean. You still need some new tactics.

And Wolf is right. Political opinion hardly falls under the umbrella of "bigotry". My opinion of Republicans is completely justifiable.

Originally posted by Suzianne
I did not concede anything. I said, "Okay, have it your way."

You said "I'm bigoted against Republicans", and you said it to twhitehead.

Originally posted by Suzianne
And Wolf is right. Political opinion hardly falls under the umbrella of "bigotry". My opinion of Republicans is completely justifiable.

I don't think offering stereotypes about a large diverse group of people is justifiable.

Originally posted by Suzianne
And Wolf is right. Political opinion hardly falls under the umbrella of "bigotry". My opinion of Republicans is completely justifiable.

It depends on what those opinions are.
If you believe 'republicans are liars', that is bigotry.
If you believe 'women are only republicans if they are rich', that is bigotry.
If you believe 'republicans are conservative' that isn't bigotry.
If you believe republican policies are not the best plan for the country, that is not bigotry.

Originally posted by twhitehead
Yes, I am biased against Christians. But that does not mean that my bias against you is because you are Christian, nor does it mean anything I said to you in this thread had anything to do with you being a Christian.

[b]You know what they say about something if it looks like a duck, and walks like a duck and sounds like a duck, it's probably a duck.[/b ...[text shortened]... o back and reread my posts in a less defensive manner you will see that it was all in your mind.

"You have a quite serious persecution complex and read 'attack' into my posts even when it isn't there."

"... even when it isn't there." So you are admitting that sometimes, it IS there?

And when did I claim that you were "attacking" me? I only claimed that I was "close to being offended" and that your statement was just another stereotype I've seen before. I didn't claim that you were attacking me until you did start attacking me for calling your question stereotypical. And how in the world does "religion such as Islam" compare to "political views such as communism"? Only in your stereotypes would you assume that an American Christian would naturally distrust Islam and communism. Rather than being "all in my mind", I think it was "all in your words".

Originally posted by FMF
Wait. So whether something is 'biased' depends on whether or not you agree with it ~ is that what you mean?

Wait. I'd appreciate it if you'd stop putting words in my mouth and then asking me if that's what I mean. Perhaps you missed that the first time. What I meant is what I said. Stop trying to embellish it.

Originally posted by FMF
I don't think offering stereotypes about a large diverse group of people is justifiable.

I don't think offering your opinion about something you've only "read about" is justifiable.

Originally posted by Suzianne
Wait. I'd appreciate it if you stop putting words in my mouth and then asking me if that's what I mean. Perhaps you missed that the first time. What I meant is what I said. Stop trying to embellish it.

These were your words [to twhitehead]:

I'm usually surprised when I read your posts in the Debates forum, because I generally agree with them, and I see that you're capable of writing opinions about other people without bias. And then you come to the Spirituality forum and then things subtly change here when you speak about Christians.

So, perhaps you can respond to this straightforward follow-up observation: it seems, for you, that whether something is deemed 'biased' depends on whether or not you agree with it.

I'm not putting any words in your mouth. I am asking you to explain the words that came out of your mouth.

Originally posted by Suzianne
I don't think offering your opinion about something you've only "read about" is justifiable.

What is it I have only "read about"?

Originally posted by Suzianne
"... even when it isn't there." So you are admitting that sometimes, it IS there?

Yes certainly. This forum is after all for both debate and discussion.

And when did I claim that you were "attacking" me? I only claimed that I was "close to being offended" and that your statement was just another stereotype I've seen before.
Except it wasn't a stereotype at all. I didn't think you were anti-communist, but I did know that you would understand that many americans are anti-communist and that communism was the big bad evil before Muslims took the spotlight. I thought it worth comparing the two.

And how in the world does "religion such as Islam" compare to "political views such as communism"?
That is what I wanted to explore. To what extent should one choose ones dates based on religion or political views and is one bias more justifiable than the other.

Only in your stereotypes would you assume that an American Christian would naturally distrust Islam and communism.
And I made no such assumption. You assumed I did instead of reading my posts.

Rather than being "all in my mind", I think it was "all in your words".
Where in my words did I make any such claim? Nope, it was all in your mind. I never once mentioned 'American Christian' nor did I ever say that you, or an American Christian naturally distrusts Islam and communism. You made that up.

Originally posted by FMF
These were your words [to twhitehead]:

[b] I'm usually surprised when I read your posts in the Debates forum, because I generally agree with them, and I see that you're capable of writing opinions about other people without bias. And then you come to the Spirituality forum and then things subtly change here when you speak about Christians.

So, perhaps ...[text shortened]... tting any words in your mouth. I am asking you to explain the words that came out of your mouth.[/b]

Do you understand grammar? Do you understand what exactly the word 'and' means? Do you even see that the words 'agree with them' and 'without bias' appear on opposite sides of the word 'and'?

Stop trying to misrepresent what I said. Most of your posts you've ever written to me contain some variation of this type of grammar ploy.

Originally posted by Suzianne
Do you understand grammar? Do you understand what exactly the word 'and' means? Do you even see that the words 'agree with them' and 'without bias' appear on opposite sides of the word 'and'?

Stop trying to misrepresent what I said. Most of your posts you've [b]ever written to me contain some variation of this type of grammar ploy.[/b]

So you declaring him to be not biased on the other forum has nothing to do with the fact you "generally agree" with him? But if you were talking about bias and lack of bias, what did whether or not you agree with him have to do with it?