Originally posted by e4chrisYou accept the precepts of religion, there is ALWAYS a mental cost. You give up the right to think for yourself for one thing. You buy into all the perversions of whatever religion you accept, like the religious based racial bias or the subjugation of women.
When religion becomes state, thats when people need protection from it, why I wouldn't convert to Islam. But government can be just as bad, in russia people needed more protecting from stalin... I think mostly religions provide protection, rather then people needing to be protected from them. But there are exceptions yes.
A religion should be judged on the basis of the worse of it not the best. I don't mean an isolated case of a religious nutter going really insane and killing people I mean the inherent philosophy inside the religion like in 'scientology', one of the most fake religions ever devised, you have to sign a document giving them one BILLION years of loyalty. Like people will live that long, but the sinister intent is clear, you are joining the religious mafia, for life, you don't get to quit.
Christians poo poo over the verse in the bible that says a man is worth 50 shekels and a woman 35 but that tells the man made nature of the entire edifice of all the Abrahamic religions quite clearly.
But because of the effect called cognitive dissonance, they hold that background inside their heads proclaiming that doesn't happen here but it is ALWAYS there in the background BECAUSE of the conditioning inherent in ANY religion.
03 Mar 13
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Originally posted by sonhouseIt seems unfair to me for you to judge a whole group of individuals by one statement here and there taken out of the context and time that it was made. Perhaps in those physically labor intensive times, that to value a man as 50 shekels and a woman 35 shekels may have made sense to them. We sometimes have a tendency to butt in to things before we know what is going on.
You accept the precepts of religion, there is ALWAYS a mental cost. You give up the right to think for yourself for one thing. You buy into all the perversions of whatever religion you accept, like the religious based racial bias or the subjugation of women.
A religion should be judged on the basis of the worse of it not the best. I don't mean an isolate it is ALWAYS there in the background BECAUSE of the conditioning inherent in ANY religion.
It is clear from a thorough reading of the Holy Bible that the Israelites were not perfect and that is not why God chose them to carry out his purposes among men. You seem to think God approved of everything they did and commanded them to do everything they did. You seem to forget about the hand of Moses in all this and that God was not always happy with the actions of Moses. God even denied Moses the right to go into the promised land. They attempted to follow God and failed.
The people of the USA have many times attempted to follow God and failed. We also gave less worth to a woman than a man and even more worth to a white man than a black man. So who are we to criticize these people in the Holy Bible when we are guilty of the same or, maybe in some cases, worse?
03 Mar 13
Originally posted by RJHindsYou can't see past your own nose. Where do you think those concepts came from?
It seems unfair to me for you to judge a whole group of individuals by one statement here and there taken out of the context and time that it was made. Perhaps in those physically labor intensive times, that to value a man as 50 shekels and a woman 35 shekels may have made sense to them. We sometimes have a tendency to butt in to things before we know what ...[text shortened]... ze these people in the Holy Bible when we are guilty of the same or, maybe in some cases, worse?
When your BIBLE says women are worth less than men, that sticks, that is written in stone and there are 1 billion people conditioned by those verses. Another billion under the sway of Islam. 2 billion people at each other's throats and I say no god would set up such an insane situation unless that god just likes to see humans squirm.
Of course you just stick your head back up your ass and say that has nothing to do with it. Our civilization, our world wide civilization is basically insane and a large part of it is the conditioning inherent in these religions, giving people the rational to kill, force religions on otherwise peaceful people and subjugate women even today. There is nothing you can say that will disprove that.
03 Mar 13
Originally posted by sonhouseBut a Christian nation sets its women free and does not subjugate them, so all the more reason that the whole world should turn to Christianity. 😏
You can't see past your own nose. Where do you think those concepts came from?
When your BIBLE says women are worth less than men, that sticks, that is written in stone and there are 1 billion people conditioned by those verses. Another billion under the sway of Islam. 2 billion people at each other's throats and I say no god would set up such an insane ...[text shortened]... l people and subjugate women even today. There is nothing you can say that will disprove that.
HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord! Holy! Holy! Holy!
04 Mar 13
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Originally posted by sonhouseThey've always been around, before you had the jews you had lots of strange polytheistic religions, like the hindus, just about anything could be worshiped...
You accept the precepts of religion, there is ALWAYS a mental cost. You give up the right to think for yourself for one thing. You buy into all the perversions of whatever religion you accept, like the religious based racial bias or the subjugation of women.
A religion should be judged on the basis of the worse of it not the best. I don't mean an isolate it is ALWAYS there in the background BECAUSE of the conditioning inherent in ANY religion.
I think the religions that stem from Judaism are a form of mind control yes, definately, but i think the jews wanted to do that because ejypt was so crazy, the pyramids were covered in marble at the time, polished, it takes worshipping false idols to a new level, they wanted to sanitise people with a notion of sin. and its a good thing on the whole.
04 Mar 13
Originally posted by e4chrisBut last month you said:
I think the religions that stem from Judaism are a form of mind control yes, definately...
"I'm getting more interested in Christianity, and giving it much much more credit then I used too."
And you argued that you were looking for a Christian church that would accept you.
04 Mar 13
1 edit
Originally posted by divegeesterso? if you read 2 the end of the sentence.... but........
But last month you said:
[b]"I'm getting more interested in Christianity, and giving it much much more credit then I used too."
And you argued that you were looking for a Christian church that would accept you.[/b]
04 Mar 13
Originally posted by e4chrisDoes that "but" therefore mean that you are not saying:
so? if you read 2 the end of the sentence.... but........
"...religions that stem from Judaism are a form of mind control yes, definately,"
and that you are still "giving Christianity more credit than you used to" and looking for a Christian church that will accept you?
I'm not sure what you really mean as you are giving mixed messages.
04 Mar 13
3 edits
Originally posted by divegeesterI have been going to church for about a year, I'm not sure how christian I am but i really like the people... and I think Jesus is king of philosophy... I'm not quite there with all the miracles...
Does that [b]"but" therefore mean that you are not saying:
"...religions that stem from Judaism are a form of mind control yes, definately,"
and that you are still "giving Christianity more credit than you used to" and looking for a Christian church that will accept you?
I'm not sure what you really mean as you are giving mixed messages.[/b]
Yes I think islam, christianity and judaism are forms of 'mind control' the main control being the notion of sin. but i don't see that as a bad thing, on the contrary i see it as necersary. Scientology sounds like a more unhealthy type of 'mind control' tho i could be wrong.
04 Mar 13
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Originally posted by e4chrisMy experience of organised religion was one of manipulation and pressure to conform and despite the people being "nice" it really got to me after a while and I left, never to return. I remain a Christian in name mostly but I do still seek. One of my JW "buddies" here at RHP calls me a "nominal Christian" but that's more out of judgement than objectivity.
I have been going to church for about a year, I'm not sure how christian I am but i really like the people... and I think Jesus is king of philosophy... I'm not quite there with all the miracles...
Yes I think islam, christianity and judaism are forms of 'mind control' the main control being the notion of sin. but i don't see that as a bad thing, on the c ...[text shortened]... ry. Scientology sounds like a more unhealthy type of 'mind control' tho i could be wrong.
A certain amount of mind manipulation affects everyone every day, advertising for example, or management leadership programs in big companies. But organised religion often attracts a certain kind leadership and it takes robust discernment, personal centered strength and a close walk with God for many people to exist within that construct - unless of course they believe the lie that their organisation's leadership are the sole recipients of a god's truth, enlightenment and salvation; at that point a religion veers off into cultism imo.
I think it's possible to find pretty much whatever brand of philosophy or religion you are looking for these days, but if there is popularity attached to it there will be money attached to it and then the problems start.
All the best with your seeking.
Matt 7:7
Jer 29:13
06 Mar 13
Originally posted by e4chrisIf you find a church in which the people always have a positive outlook about life and are not trying to pressure you into doing things you don't feel comfortable with or make you feel guilty about things that you would not normally feel quilty about on your own, then stick with that church. You are not likely to find one church that teaches all truth without any error, however the church should not stray from the basic Christian doctines that were accepted before the split in the church. That is my opinion.
I'm lucky in the church I found, by chance, is not in the least bit culty or control like.... They are very proactive about doing good things instead, And I like them for that...
07 Mar 13
Originally posted by sonhouseNo. I've visited this subject with you many times now. My answer is the same as it was every other time.
So for you all the abuses I mentioned are all ok because god is just or some such?
All the abuses you mentioned were the interference of evil men. Not God.
When man abuses religious doctrine, it is man being evil, not God.
07 Mar 13
Originally posted by twhiteheadNo, what he wants is freedom from the actions of evil men who then claim they were working for God.
Nevertheless, religion [b]is involved in all the things he mentioned that he wants freedom from.[/b]
These things he mentions are not the fault of religion or God. They are the abusive actions of evil men.
07 Mar 13
Originally posted by e4chrisI believe it was limestone, not marble.
They've always been around, before you had the jews you had lots of strange polytheistic religions, like the hindus, just about anything could be worshiped...
I think the religions that stem from Judaism are a form of mind control yes, definately, but i think the jews wanted to do that because ejypt was so crazy, the pyramids were covered in marble at th ...[text shortened]... level, they wanted to sanitise people with a notion of sin. and its a good thing on the whole.