16 Apr 05
Originally posted by ColettiOK. Show us that the Son of Man referred to is not Jesus in the quoted text. What is the correct interpretation?
Merely guesses. Nothing in the text leads to your answers. You must either agree that you are guessing, or show support for your answers using other scripture. For instance - how do you know the Son of Man is Jesus? Not from the text quoted. You can take many parts of the Bible and asset whatever you feel like.
16 Apr 05
Originally posted by ColettiYou're a pathetic fraud, Coletti. I notice you haven't tried to give ANY interpretion at all to the passage. You're dropping perilously close to the Darfius "secret decoder ring" theory of Scripture; only "Christians" can understand what the Bible says. The only reasoning I've used is the clear and unambiguous meaning of a passage quoting your God's words on the most important event of all time: Judgement Day. The fact that you won't address Jesus' words at all shows that you aren't even a Christian.
It is God's word. But no1 can only guess what it means because he insist that he can take it out of context and ignore the rest of the Bible. Jesus said many things that require knowledge of the OT and help from other books of the Bible to understand. The Christian view of Scripture is not just that the words of Christ count, but that the Bible itself i ...[text shortened]... est of the Bible.
No1 is trying to make establish a point of doctrine using poor reasoning.
16 Apr 05
Originally posted by no1marauderHere's a bit of backup to refer to:
You're a pathetic fraud, Coletti. I notice you haven't tried to give ANY interpretion at all to the passage. You're dropping perilously close to the Darfius "secret decoder ring" theory of Scripture; only "Christians" can understand what the Bible says. The only reasoning I've used is the clear and unambiguous meaning of a passage quoting ...[text shortened]... The fact that you won't address Jesus' words at all shows that you aren't even a Christian.
John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words:and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
14:24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.
16 Apr 05
Originally posted by sasquatch672John 5:25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
So...lessay that you go to a village in Tibet where there's no radio, television, very limited traffic in and out of the place, the terrain is very forbidding. So to date, no brave Christian souls have ventured forth to this place to preach the word and convert these heathens.
Do they go to hell?
What about the small children that died in the Boxing Day tsunami? Do they go to hell because they never received the Word?
It would be foolish to think if a person did not hear of Jesus in this life they would be condemend to hell. Jesus is the same yesterday, today and yes forevermore. His death on the cross is God reaching out for all mankind, past present and future, reconciling the world unto Himself.
16 Apr 05
Originally posted by no1marauderOn that Great day of Judgement THE LORD will judge the righteous and unrighteous Believers. The sheep are the true believers. The goats are the false believers. Those that are true Believers will enter into that promise that GOD has given to all those that believe and have followed all the teachings of JESUS CHRIST. The goats are those that claim the Salvation of JESUS CHRIST, but are not Living in that truth of that Salvation.Those are those Christians that claim to believe but, have not separrated themselves from the world. They have heard the teachings of JESUS CHRIST, but have not kept them.These are those that pretend to be Christians.These are those Christians that have misused the teachings and the Salvation of JESUS. They shall recieve the same punishment as the unbelievers and those that have rejected JESUS CHRIST. Hope that helps
I've posted this before, but I leave it to everybody to judge for themselves how "unclear" and impossible to understand Matthew 25:31-46 is:
31 But when the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the angels with him, then shall he sit on the throne of his glory:
32 and before him shall be gathered all the nations: an ...[text shortened]... to eternal life
Yup, there's all kinds of ambiguity there, isn't there, Coletti?
16 Apr 05
1 edit
Originally posted by blindfaith101No, it doesn't because it ignores Jesus' words. ALL NATIONS means exactly that, not merely a subset of "believers". Show me in the passage where it refers to only "believers".
On that Great day of Judgement THE LORD will judge the righteous and unrighteous Believers. The sheep are the true believers. The goats are the false believers. Those that are true Believers will enter into that promise that GOD has g ...[text shortened]... lievers and those that have rejected JESUS CHRIST. Hope that helps
EDIT: Matthew 25:32 32 and before him shall be gathered all the nations:
16 Apr 05
Originally posted by no1marauderthen the goats would also include the unbelievers and the rejectors of Salvation.
No, it doesn't because it ignores Jesus' words. ALL NATIONS means exactly that, not merely a subset of "believers". Show me in the passage where it refers to only "believers".
EDIT: Matthew 25:32 32 and before him shall be gathered all the nations:
16 Apr 05
Originally posted by no1marauderYou want THE WORD OF GOD, to mean what you want, not what it says. CHRIST clearly has taught that only by acceptting HIM and HIS Teachings is the only way to get into Heaven.There is no other way. Yes is going to gather all the nations together. True HE is going seperate those that believe in what HE taught. True HE is going to send all unbelievers to everlasting punishment.
It doesn't say that, does it? It says ALL NATIONS will be judged on how they treated their fellow man. Period. You can read, can't you?
16 Apr 05
Originally posted by blindfaith101But that's not what he says in Matthew 25:31-46. So either Matthew 25 is wrong or you are. Who should a "Christian" believe: the Word of Jesus or the words of you?
You want THE WORD OF GOD, to mean what you want, not what it says. CHRIST clearly has taught that only by acceptting HIM and HIS Teachings is the only way to get into Heaven.There is no other way. Yes is going to gather all the nations together. True HE is going seperate those that believe in what HE taught. True HE is going to send all unbelievers to everlasting punishment.
16 Apr 05
41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into the eternal fire which is prepared for the devil and his angels:
42 for I was hungry, and ye did not give me to eat; I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink;
43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in; naked, and ye clothed me not; sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
44 Then shall they also answer, saying, Lord, when saw we thee hungry, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not unto one of these least, ye did it not unto me.
46 And these shall go away into eternal punishment: but the righteous into eternal life
Those are the ones who are damned and what are they damned for? For not treating their fellow man properly. Where is there a word in Matthew 25 about faith or belief, BF101?
16 Apr 05
Originally posted by no1marauderThe whole chapter is about faith and belief. You still cannot change it into what you want it to be. As it says "When did we see you". When did they see CHRIST.
41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into the eternal fire which is prepared for the devil and his angels:
42 for I was hungry, and ye did not give me to eat; I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink;
43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in; naked, and ye clothed me not; sick, and in prison, and ye vis ...[text shortened]... ing their fellow man properly. Where is there a word in Matthew 25 about faith or belief, BF101?
16 Apr 05
Originally posted by blindfaith101You really can't read, can you?
The whole chapter is about faith and belief. You still cannot change it into what you want it to be. As it says "When did we see you". When did they see CHRIST.
44 Then shall they also answer, saying, Lord, when saw we thee hungry, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not unto one of these least, ye did it not unto me.
Get it?