02 Oct 11
Originally posted by googlefudgeYes, I think I understand your point of view now. I believe you said if
ah, depends on what your talking about.
I am indeed a skeptic, I don't trust what anyone says simply because they say it.
I require evidence and reason to back things up, however if evidence and reason
convince me something is right I will change my opinions/beliefs to accommodate it.
This does include belief in the existence of god/s, given str ...[text shortened]... cy and that the
towers were brought down with explosives is a denier.
Does that help?
you had enough evidence you would change your mind about the
existence of God. Therefore, it is a matter of how much evidence
would be enough. You will never get that evidence from just reading
the skeptics point of view. The Holy Bible says "seek and you shall find."
So if you are serious, you must seek the truth, not from skepics, but
from where the truth can be found.
- Joined
- 31 May 06
- Moves
- 1795
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by RJHindsAh but as I have said previously what would constitute good evidence...
Yes, I think I understand your point of view now. I believe you said if
you had enough evidence you would change your mind about the
existence of God. Therefore, it is a matter of how much evidence
would be enough. You will never get that evidence from just reading
the skeptics point of view. The Holy Bible says "seek and you shall find."
So if you ...[text shortened]... re serious, you must seek the truth, not from skepics, but
from where the truth can be found.
http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?subject=For_atheist_scum&threadid=141904
.... does not include the bible.
Or anything any people could do or say.
The kind of evidence I would require to believe in the existence of a god is not something
I would have trouble finding if it existed.
It would be impossible to miss the kind of evidence I would require to believe.
This is why I am confident in my lack of belief.
I know the kind of things that would qualify as good evidence are unmissable.
Thus as we haven't found them I know there is no evidence currently that would convince me.
This does not preclude a god that hides his existence.
But then I am never going to find evidence of the existence of such a god.
Which means I am never going to believe in it.
The trouble is this.
The more powerful and fantastic a thing is supposed to be, the more extraordinary it is.
The more powerful and fantastic the evidence needs to be to justify belief in it.
God is postulated to be ultimately powerful, so for evidence to be conclusive, it must be only explicable
by an ultimately powerful being.
If it could be explained by a less powerful being then the less powerful being is more likely than the more
powerful one, god.
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by googlefudgeIt appears you are not willing to give God a chance unless He does
Ah but as I have said previously what would constitute good evidence...
http://www.redhotpawn.com/board/showthread.php?subject=For_atheist_scum&threadid=141904
.... does not include the bible.
Or anything any people could do or say.
The kind of evidence I would require to believe in the existence of a god is not something
I would have trouble ...[text shortened]... ss powerful being then the less powerful being is more likely than the more
powerful one, god.
something like "slap you in the face" and even that would not be
enough because you would think something else did it because
you could not see him. I also think I remember you saying that
you would not want to believe in the kind of God in the Holy Bible
that you think has a mental disorder or something to that effect.
02 Oct 11
2 edits
Luke 16:31
".... neither will they be convinced if someone should rise from the dead."
I was reminded of the verse.
It has been my experience that the hard line skeptics cannot pinpoint exactly what would be enough evidence for God; and, as pointed out, they are predisposed by hatred anyway, not to believe.
In a nutshell, the hard line skeptic will not believe; and if a perponderance of contrary evidence is presented, they will shift from disbelief to outright denial; contradictorily, denial out of hatred for a God they refuse to believe exists in the first place!
According to the Parable of the Sower, these folks would be likened to "the path" where seed falls and gets eaten up by birds before it can take root.
- Joined
- 31 May 06
- Moves
- 1795
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by RJHindsIf god turned up tomorrow, and started doing things like rearranging the solar system
It appears you are not willing to give God a chance unless He does
something like "slap you in the face" and even that would not be
enough because you would think something else did it because
you could not see him. I also think I remember you saying that
you would not want to believe in the kind of God in the Holy Bible
that you think has a mental disorder or something to that effect.
adding in a few dozen gas giants with hundreds of moons, held in orbits impossible under
the normal laws of physics many of which were instantly terraformed to be suitable places
for humans to live, Instantly rebuilding all our power stations as nuclear fusion reactors
with zero carbon emission's, replacing our oil distribution network and petrol/diesel powered
cars with a hydrogen network and hydrogen fuel cell cars.
Started making sure that tsunamis, hurricanes, earthquakes, volcano's, and tornado's, never hurt
anyone or damage property, Gave us the blueprints and technology for us to build space elevators
and space ships to colonise all those new worlds, or even telleporting millions of people (on demand)
to new homes on these other worlds so that overpopulation was a thing of the past.
That would be convincing enough for me that there was a god.
And that the being was actually useful.
This would not necessarily mean I would worship the god.
- Joined
- 31 May 06
- Moves
- 1795
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by sumydidI have no hatred of god, that would be silly, as I don't think he/she/they/it exists.
Luke 16:31
".... neither will they be convinced if someone should rise from the dead."
I was reminded of the verse.
It has been my experience that the hard line skeptics cannot pinpoint exactly what would be enough evidence for God; and, as pointed out, they are predisposed by hatred anyway, not to believe.
In a nutshell, the hard line ske ...[text shortened]... e likened to "the path" where seed falls and gets eaten up by birds before it can take root.
However as described in the bible, the god you believe in I find abhorrent.
In the same way that lord voldermort in the potter books is abhorrent.
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by googlefudgeYou would then be just like Satan, who believes in God, but will not
If god turned up tomorrow, and started doing things like rearranging the solar system
adding in a few dozen gas giants with hundreds of moons, held in orbits impossible under
the normal laws of physics many of which were instantly terraformed to be suitable places
for humans to live, Instantly rebuilding all our power stations as nuclear fusion reac ...[text shortened]... at the being was actually useful.
This would not necessarily mean I would worship the god.
worship Him, but fights against Him.
- Joined
- 31 May 06
- Moves
- 1795
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by RJHindsActually satan works for god, torturing people in hell for him.
You would then be just like Satan, who believes in God, but will not
worship Him, but fights against Him.
If he was really working against god he would be making hell a great place for
all the sinners to enjoy, and train and build up as an army to fight god.
If satan is as powerful as god, then god isn't all powerful.
If satan is less powerful than god, then god could defeat satan any time he likes
and thus Satan's (posited) continued existence and influence is only there by gods
will.
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by DasaDefine your perception of God please.
God is first cause - and therefore uncaused.
God is inconceivable power.
All power.
Having all power God has the power to be first cause.
We all can recognize power exists - so God is the source of that power.
Nothing caused God.
The fact that God is uncaused and all power is why he is God and worshipable.
We are part of that power.
We a ...[text shortened]... number of other names.
First cause is absolutely - not nothing.
Nothing produces nothing.
Simple question.
How do you perceive this form of a God?
-m.
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by sumydidIt has been my experience that the hard line skeptics cannot pinpoint exactly what would be enough evidence for God; and, as pointed out, they are predisposed by hatred anyway, not to believe.
Luke 16:31
".... neither will they be convinced if someone should rise from the dead."
I was reminded of the verse.
It has been my experience that the hard line skeptics cannot pinpoint exactly what would be enough evidence for God; and, as pointed out, they are predisposed by hatred anyway, not to believe.
In a nutshell, the hard line ske ...[text shortened]... e likened to "the path" where seed falls and gets eaten up by birds before it can take root.
I have similar difficulty pinpointing exactly when my cups of coffee change from being hot to only being warm. Granted a level of redundancy however I can certainly pick *a* time when it's warm.
In the same fashion though I can't tell you the minimum amount evidence I'd need to be convinced a god exists I could probably give you a set of criteria, which if satisfied, would almost surely guarantee that I would believe.
In a nutshell, the hard line skeptic will not believe; and if a perponderance of contrary evidence is presented, they will shift from disbelief to outright denial; contradictorily, denial out of hatred for a God they refuse to believe exists in the first place!
We haven't been given the chance to prove you wrong here ;]
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by googlefudgeSatan has you hook, line, and sinker.
Actually satan works for god, torturing people in hell for him.
If he was really working against god he would be making hell a great place for
all the sinners to enjoy, and train and build up as an army to fight god.
If satan is as powerful as god, then god isn't all powerful.
If satan is less powerful than god, then god could defeat satan an ...[text shortened]... es
and thus Satan's (posited) continued existence and influence is only there by gods
will.
02 Oct 11
Originally posted by AgergI think it has already been proven by other hard line skeptics over
[b]It has been my experience that the hard line skeptics cannot pinpoint exactly what would be enough evidence for God; and, as pointed out, they are predisposed by hatred anyway, not to believe.
I have similar difficulty pinpointing exactly when my cups of coffee change from being hot to only being warm. Granted a level of redundancy however I can ...[text shortened]... exists in the first place![/b]
We haven't been given the chance to prove you wrong here ;][/b]
thousands of years.