I good enough for God's Kingdom because X

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Gosh which part of 'no one is capable of righteous actions' did you miss?

No one is capable of "righteous actions"? Are you sure? What a misanthropic view of humanity yours is.

It also makes your opinion different from KellyJay's which is that only people who believe in Christ are capable of "righteous actions".

Originally posted by FMF
No one is capable of "righteous actions"? Are you sure? What a misanthropic view of humanity yours is.

It also makes your opinion different from KellyJay's which is that only people who believe in Christ are capable of "righteous actions".

Agreed. All people are capable of righteous actions, irrespective whether or not they believe in God, Allah, FSM or anything else. It is just who you are, good or bad. Christians are supposed and expected to be more "righteous" but it is harder then people realise.

Originally posted by Nicksten
Christians are supposed and expected to be more "righteous" but it is harder then people realise.

It may be a bit unscientific, but I have not seen one shred of evidence in all my years here that the Christians demonstrate behaviour that is more "righteous" than the non-Christians.

Furthermore, some of the Christian ideologues here studiously avoid ever talking about how their "righteous actions" manifest themselves in real life.

Instead, they plunge back into their remote and joyless textual analysis, day in day out, as if their religious beliefs have no particular application in their lives and are instead little more than a kind of academic subject.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Gosh which part of 'no one is capable of righteous actions' did you miss?

Did the nihilism of your view that "no one is capable of righteous actions" draw you to Christianity, or has Christianity caused you to subscribe to a nihilistic view that you did not previously have, i.e. that "no one is capable of righteous actions"? Which way round was it?

Originally posted by FMF
No one is capable of "righteous actions"? Are you sure? What a misanthropic view of humanity yours is.

It also makes your opinion different from KellyJay's which is that only people who believe in Christ are capable of "righteous actions".

It all depends on who defines 'righteous actions'.

I did say everyone is capable righteous actions by their own definition of righteous. According to the scriptures only God is righteous and all our righteous deeds are like filthy rags before God. So by God's definition of righteous no man is righteous. Self-righteous, yes.

Originally posted by FMF
Did the nihilism of your view that "no one is capable of righteous actions" draw you to Christianity, or has Christianity caused you to subscribe to a nihilistic view that you did not previously have, i.e. that "no one is capable of righteous actions"? Which way round was it?

Maybe you need to define what you mean by 'righteous' because we clearly have different definitions.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
When you say it is scripturally supported you are referring to the Bible as a whole or one passage that you have taken out of context?

One passage I have taken out of context.

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
One passage I have taken out of context.

Thanks for clearing that up, my dear friend Casper.

I am a righteous unbeliever.

It is scripturally supported that God will excuse my unbelief and welcome me into his kingdom, based on the law that is instinctively written on my heart, governing my righteous actions.

He will welcome you to where you do not want to be ?
Under God's administration is where you do NOT wish to be.
So what is this about you expecting God to drag you off to a place you disdain to live ?

Now you do have an interesting allusion to Romans 1:15. This was interesting. It says -

( ... "For when the Gentiles, who have no law, do by nature the things of the law, these, though they have no law, are a law to themselves,

Who show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience bearing witness with it and their reasonings, one with the other, accusing or even excusing them.)

In the day when God judges the secrets of men according to my gospel through Jesus Christ." (Rom. 2:14-16)

This passage does say men have a law written in their hearts. But this passage does not say that men are fully able to LIVE UP TO the goodness of that law that is in them.

This passage indicates that Gentiles / nations have a knowledge of good and evil. It does not say they have the life power to resist the evil that they know nor the life power to perform the good that they know.

They have a nature of the law, a kind of "law unto themselves". No one has lived up to it. All have violated it.

God is perfect.
God the Judge is not just very good. He is perfect.
Something has gone terribly wrong with this man in whom is created a law in himself but cannot avoid its violation in some degree.

This passage also does not contain enough information to let you know HOW God will ultimately recompense you. It only says that on the day of judgment before Christ your reasonings and conscience will accuse or even excuse you in this or that matter.

Mind you that a criminal on his way to be executed may have his conscience accuse and excuse him. The excusing reasonings God may agree with. He knows all the facts better than yourself. This does not guarantee any exemption from judgment.

There is not enough in this passage to assure anyone that he or she will be excused before God - "in the day when God judges the secrets of men according to my gospel through Jesus Christ"

A very active mind and tongue reasoning and excusing or self accusing, is all that is guaranteed for sure to take place.

There is much more in the chapter to indicate that all are in need of justification by God for self justification will fail.

IE. If you judges others and you yourself do the same things, what hope is there apart from God's justifying you ?

"Therefore you are without excuse, O every man who judges, for in what you judge another you condemn yourself; for you who judge practice the same things.

But we know that the judgment of God is according to truth upon those who practice such things.

And do you consider this, O man, who judge those who practice such things and do the same yourself that you will escape the judgment of God ? (Rom. 2:1-3)

Eveyone knows that Atheists are hugely judgmental of other people. They are so very clear eyed on who is wrong and why. But God will manifest how you do the same things yourself.

There is another section in this part of Romans on the same problem with the religious (2:17 - 3:8)

"All have sinned" is the climax Paul arrives at in this section on the need for Justification from Condemnation.

" Even as it is written, There is none righteous, not even one." (3:11)

Furthermore, man who knows of Jesus Christ the Savior and ignores, rejects, or spurns the gospel, is taking advantage of God's long suffering and God's affording the sinner time to be saved.

" Or do you despise the riches of His kindness and forebearance and longsuffering, not knowing that God's kindness is leading you to REPENTENCE?

But according to your hardness and unrepentant heart, you are storing up for yourself wrath in the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God ..." ( 2:4,5)

So you atheists coming here showing off before each other, vying with each other, boasting of the hardness of your hearts against God, are just accumulating each passing day greater wrath against yourselves. What seems like a game to you, will become not a laughing matter some day.

More time to agree with God that you need salvation, is allocated by the Savior God.
More forbearance that you may pray and confess the need for extended forgiveness through Jesus Christ, is granted.

But any thought of being dragged by God to a kingdom of God in which you have no desire to BE, is a foolish expectation.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
It all depends on who defines 'righteous actions'.

I did say everyone is capable righteous actions by their own definition of righteous. According to the scriptures only God is righteous and all our righteous deeds are like filthy rags before God. So by God's definition of righteous no man is righteous. Self-righteous, yes.

People will think you're trying to hide behind some religious dogma and not take responsibility for what you say. Do you personally think - according to your own definition - that no one is capable of righteous actions?

Originally posted by FMF
It may be a bit unscientific, but I have not seen one shred of evidence in all my years here that the Christians demonstrate behaviour that is more "righteous" than the non-Christians.

Furthermore, some of the Christian ideologues here studiously avoid ever talking about how their "righteous actions" manifest themselves in real life.

Instead, they plunge ...[text shortened]... rticular application in their lives and are instead little more than a kind of academic subject.

I can't say the same though as I have seen better behavior in some cases BUT it's obvious you have not which is a shame.

Anyways, it opens up a whole new discussion on what everyone in their own sees as "righteous actions" or behavior etc. For example, some may say its righteous to kill a serial killer who has killed many many children...is it? Some will say yes and some will say no, thus in my opinion everyone is right because how they see righteousness differs from the other, and frankly thats just how they believe. So who is right and righteous and who is not?

Taking the above example, Christians are guided by the Bible which clearly says "you shall not kill" in Exodus 20:13, which is a moral imperative.

Furthermore, some of the Christian ideologues here studiously avoid ever talking about how their "righteous actions" manifest themselves in real life.
Not only just Christians 😉

Originally posted by Nicksten
FMF: Furthermore, some of the Christian ideologues here studiously avoid ever talking about how their "righteous actions" manifest themselves in real life.
Nicksten: Not only just Christians 😉

I assume that every person is capable of righteous actions. I am not claiming that only Christians are capable of righteous actions. So I think there is some onus on Christians (who do) to explain what actions they take - in real everyday life - that they think are righteous when they do them, that are somehow not righteous when non-Christians do them, and why.

Originally posted by FMF
People will think you're trying to hide behind some religious dogma and not take responsibility for what you say. Do you personally think - according to your own definition - that no one is capable of righteous actions?

It would aid this discussion if you defined what you mean by 'righteous'.

Originally posted by FMF
I assume that every person is capable of righteous actions. I am not claiming that only Christians are capable of righteous actions. So I think there is some onus on Christians (who do) to explain what actions they take - in real everyday life - that they think are righteous when they do them, that are somehow not righteous when non-Christians do them, and why.

100% Agreed, even the Bible says "The righteous will live by faith." (Gal 3:11)

Originally posted by FMF
I assume that every person is capable of righteous actions. I am not claiming that only Christians are capable of righteous actions. So I think there is some onus on Christians (who do) to explain what actions they take - in real everyday life - that they think are righteous when they do them, that are somehow not righteous when non-Christians do them, and why.

Taking this part...
So I think there is some onus on Christians (who do) to explain what actions they take - in real everyday life - that they think are righteous when they do them, that are somehow not righteous when non-Christians do them, and why.

..and joking around a bit....

These people are actually called: BOSSES 😀

...Thinking they are better then everyone else 😉