21 Apr 11
Originally posted by menace71no i dont accept that it Jesus the Almighty, what is more, Christ never termed himself
Isa 44:6 and Rev 22:13-26 Jesus and the almighty both call themselves the Alpha and Omega the beginning and the end. The Lamb and God are sharing the same throne all through out the book of revelation.
www.biblegateway.com choose your version
Manny
the almighty or have you never read,
(John 14:28) . . .If you loved me, you would rejoice that I am going my way to the
Father, because the Father is greater than I am. . .
its a typical trinitarian ploy to pick a scripture which may be viewed as ambiguous and
apply it to Christ to support the claim,
21 Apr 11
1 edit
Originally posted by robbie carrobieThey both call themselves the Alpha and Omega beginning and end (maybe not almighty) Another thing at Christ birth he was called Emmanuel and you know what that means. "God with us" and well in a very literal way.
no i dont accept that it Jesus the Almighty, what is more, Christ never termed himself
the almighty or have you never read,
(John 14:28) . . .If you loved me, you would rejoice that I am going my way to the
Father, because the Father is greater than I am. . .
its a typical trinitarian ploy to pick a scripture which may be viewed as ambiguous and
apply it to Christ to support the claim,
Manny
21 Apr 11
1 edit
Originally posted by menace71so what? there are squillions of Biblical names with references to God in them, how is it that Christ says of the father that he is greater, and you dont believe it?
They both call themselves the Alpha and Omega beginning and end (maybe not almighty) Another thing at Christ birth he was called Emmanuel and you know what that means. "God with us" and well in a very literal way.
Manny
21 Apr 11
If you read the book of revelation the Lamb and the Almighty are so intertwined that you can see they are one. Another title that Christ wears is King of Kings and Lord of Lords. They share the same throne and wear the same titles and why? I thought God did not share glory? When Christ was on the earth He was trying to Glorify the father and as you say so what?
Manny
21 Apr 11
1 edit
Originally posted by menace71tell me what is it about the statement, 'the father is greater than I', that leads you to this conclusion Manny? I have read the book of revelation many times, the Bible must be taken as a whole, to state that one part states something without recourse to the rest is not very consistent and leads to erroneous assumptions.
If you read the book of revelation the Lamb and the Almighty are so intertwined that you can see they are one. Another title that Christ wears is King of Kings and Lord of Lords. They share the same throne and wear the same titles and why? I thought God did not share glory? When Christ was on the earth He was trying to Glorify the father and as you say so what?
Manny
21 Apr 11
1 edit
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI nice easy response to go back to the Hebrew. I'm happy to go that route as long as you are prepared to go through the Greek also...? Could you show the Hebrew word are referring to that is in this scripture and not in the others you are claiming , so I can look into it please?
The Hebrew word used in Isaiah 9:6 for the term 'mighty god', in relation to Jesus Christ
is different from the word used for Almighty God a term used exclusively for Jehovah
himself. How it it that you are now saying that they are one and the same? even
though scripture clearly differentiates between the two? this is the second time I have
...[text shortened]... waste my
time posting details which you are either unwilling or unable to even acknowledge.
And you still haven't responded specifically to the rest of my OP (not that you have to of course) so don't expect me to go on some wild goose chase of your making.
21 Apr 11
Originally posted by divegeesterIsaiah wasn't written in Greek, it was written in Hebrew.
I nice easy response to go back to the Hebrew. I'm happy to go that route as long as you are prepared to go through the Greek also...? Could you show the Hebrew word are referring to that is in this scripture and not in the others you are claiming , so I can look into it please?
And you still haven't responded specifically to the rest of my OP (n ...[text shortened]... that you have to of course) so don't expect me to go on some wild goose chase of your making.
In the prophecy at Isaiah 9:6 concerning the Messiah, the title “Mighty God” is applied to the promised Prince of Peace. This expression, however, translates the Hebrew El Gibbohr, not El Shaddai (The Almighty)
21 Apr 11
Originally posted by robbie carrobieIn my OP I talked about Jesus saying he is the Alpha and the Omega and you ignored it.
tell me what is it about the statement, 'the father is greater than I', that leads you to this conclusion Manny? I have read the book of revelation many times, the Bible must be taken as a whole, to state that one part states something without recourse to the rest is not very consistent and leads to erroneous assumptions.
How can you call yourself a "Christian" when you don't recognise his deity?
If you do not confess and bow the knee that Jesus is LORD - (before Abraham was) I AM - MIGHTY GOD - EVERLASTING FATHER you will die in your sins - those were his words.
Who do you pray to? Who is your Saviour? Who died for you? Who is seated on Heavens throne?
It's the SAME GOD who made himself lower than the angels and was manifested in the flesh - the veil of flesh.
21 Apr 11
Originally posted by divegeesterunbelievable denial???, please tell the forum what it is about the phrase, 'the father is greater than I', that you are unwilling to acknowledge? why are you stating that the Christ and God are the same when the Christ himself states,'the father is greater than I', that's an unbelievable denial.
Unbelievable denial!
21 Apr 11
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI'll look into this - where did you get the translation source please?
Isaiah wasn't written in Greek, it was written in Hebrew.
In the prophecy at Isaiah 9:6 concerning the Messiah, the title “Mighty God” is applied to the promised Prince of Peace. This expression, however, translates the Hebrew El Gibbohr, not El Shaddai (The Almighty)
21 Apr 11
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI acknowledge it completely. See my post above.
unbelievable denial???, please tell the forum what it is about the phrase, 'the father is greater than I', that you are unwilling to acknowledge? why are you stating that the Christ and God are the same when the Christ himself states,'the father is greater than I', that's an unbelievable denial.
Btw I am not a trinitarian. God is one God, one saviour and ONE LORD of all. He said I will Not give my Glory to another - and yet he gives it to Jesus who you say is not even deity.
21 Apr 11
1 edit
Originally posted by divegeester'the father is greater than I', please dwell on that for a moment . . . . what do you think?
In my OP I talked about Jesus saying he is the Alpha and the Omega and you ignored it.
How can you call yourself a "Christian" when you don't recognise his deity?
If you do not confess and bow the knee that Jesus is LORD - (before Abraham was) I AM - MIGHTY GOD - EVERLASTING FATHER you will die in your sins - those were his words.
Who do you who made himself lower than the angels and was manifested in the flesh - the veil of flesh.
what about this,
(Philippians 2:5-6)Keep this mental attitude in you that was also in Christ Jesus, who,
although he was existing in God’s form, gave no consideration to a seizure, namely,
that he should be equal to God. . .
why are you saying one thing when the scriptures clearly indicate another, why is that
21 Apr 11
1 edit
Originally posted by divegeesterIf God is Christ as you are trying to make out, how is it possible that no man has seen God at anytime, yet many persons saw Jesus, also how is it possible for God to die?
I acknowledge it completely. See my post above.
Btw I am not a trinitarian. God is one God, one saviour and ONE LORD of all. He said I will Not give my Glory to another - and yet he gives it to Jesus who you say is not even deity.