Is Jesus Willing?

Paul comes close to saying healing when he speaks of the renewing of the man in Christ's salvation.

"And put on the new man, which is being renewed unto full knowledge according to the image of Him who created him, where there cannot be Greek and Jew, circumcision and uncircumcision, barbarian, Scythian, slave, free man, but Christ is all and in all." (Col. 3:10,11)

The concept is that the old man is divided and stratified socially into factions of enmity. When Christ dispenses Himself into man "the new man" is being put on. And this putting on is a renewing; a kind of healing also.

Because there is a gradual putting on of this new man, the dispensing of Christ to become "all and in all" is not an instant renewing or healing. But it is powerful and effective as His cleansing away of sins in redemption.

The whole process of men and women being dispensed into by the Spirit of Christ can be thought of as a healing. They were damaged by the fall of Adam.

Ephesians 4:22-24 should be seen along with Colossians 3:10,11. It too concerns the renewing or healing of the putting on of the new man.

"That you put off, as regards your former manner of life, the old man, which is being corrupted according to the lusts of the deceit.

And that you be renewed in the spirit of your mind and put on the new man, which was created according to God in righteousness and holiness of the reality." (Eph. 4:22-24)

Originally posted by sonship

If I remember correctly, there is no record of Christ or disciples healing anyone any other way but physically. The healing of other ailments like disobedience or sinfulness is not something on record that Jesus healed.

You don't think that Jesus healed something in Peter after he had denied Jesus three times ? You don't think something ...[text shortened]... -defeatable chess skills. Actually the rooms just smells too awful.

Stop poisoning the well.

Just as I thought .. nothing in the Bible to support your claim.
Peter learned his own lesson. Jesus did not need to stop him from sinning.
God does not stop people from committing sins.
People do that for themselves if their heart is with God.
People have to cleanse themselves as Paul clearly stated.
Jesus cleansed their PAST, NOT THEIR FUTURE.

Oh .. you have poisoned your own well with your false doctrines.
This is is yet another proof.
Also I dont want to fellowship with you unless you change your ways.
You are deceitful and crooked in your preaching.. and it stinks.

Speak from the Bible instead from some mans doctrine which you adopted
and then maybe people will listen to you.,
Right now they dont.

Originally posted by Rajk999

I assume that you didn't get very far in my responses.

Just as I thought .. nothing in the Bible to support your claim.
Peter learned his own lesson. Jesus did not need to stop him from sinning.
God does not stop people from committing sins.

I think the way Jesus dealt with Peter, getting him to confess that he loved Jesus for each of the three denials, went a long way in Jesus dealing a healing treatment to Peter.

People do that for themselves if their heart is with God.
People have to cleanse themselves as Paul clearly stated.
Jesus cleansed their PAST, NOT THEIR FUTURE.

The church is Christ's mystical Body. And Christ nourishes and cherishes the church as a man would his own body.

So the care for the church by Christ is ongoing as a man would see to the health and healing of his own body. It is not only toward the past but ongoing.

" ... Christ loved the church and gave Himself up for her that He might sanctify her, cleansing her by the washing of the water in the word,

That He might present the church to Himself glorious, NOT HAVING SPOT OR WRINKLE or any such things, but that she would be holy and without blemish ...

For no man ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, even as Christ also the church, because we are members of His Body." (See Ephesians 5:25b-30)

What picture comes to your mind when you see Christ caring for "spots or wrinkle or any SUCH things." ?

I see that also involves healing.
You should read more prayerfully the whole New Testament (confessing your faults in its light).

Originally posted by Rajk999

Speak from the Bible instead from some mans doctrine which you adopted
and then maybe people will listen to you.,
Right now they dont.

Are you jealous that I derive guidance, help, edification from other Christians ?

We are suppose to be imitators of those who are inheriting the precious promises. We should emulate them and pass on to others the benefit of those leading the way into salvation.

"That you may not be sluggish, but imitators of those who through faith and long-suffering are inheriting the promises." (Heb. 6:12)

What is it with you and Divegeester in this " Don't follow men. Don't follow men's doctrines" stuff? Should we not examine to see of the teachings are right and effective ?

Ever hear about the Bereans in the book of Acts ?

I know lots of healthy brothers and sisters that I do well to follow, to imitate.

Originally posted by Rajk999

Speak from the Bible instead from some mans doctrine which you adopted
and then maybe people will listen to you.,
Right now they dont.

Do they listen to you?

In the last 6 posts from me how many passages from the Bible did I speak?
I think I included a good number straight from the pure word of God.

Originally posted by sonship
I assume that you didn't get very far in my responses.

Just as I thought .. nothing in the Bible to support your claim.
Peter learned his own lesson. Jesus did not need to stop him from sinning.
God does not stop people from committing sins.

I think the way Jesus dealt with Peter, getting him to confess that he loved Jesus for each ...[text shortened]... You should read more prayerfully the whole New Testament (confessing your faults in its light).

I did get through your response. I asked for biblical support and you provided none... meaning that you were talking your usual unbiblical nonsense.

I think its you that needs to read more prayerfully and
- ask God to stop you from being such a sycophant and stop adoring this man whom you have placed on a pedestal.
- ask God to help you take the teachings of Christ and the Apostles as it is written without superimposing your own false doctrine over it

Although I dont think God helps people whose heart and mind is already twisted, and who dont care to change. Those who belligerently continue with their own doctrine which includes trivializing sin and evil are fit for nothing but the dung heap.

Now you think you have a point about using Ephesians 5 quote, that Christ will cleanse his church. But if you read a few verses before you will see that the process of cleansing the church is by casting sinful Christians Saints OUT OF THE KINGDOM OF GOD.

Thats the method. Read it. Christians who continue with sin and evil, will not necessarily be forgiven and cleansed, but will be removed from the Kingdom Got that ?

Originally posted by sonship

Speak from the Bible instead from some mans doctrine which you adopted
and then maybe people will listen to you.,
Right now they dont.

Are you jealous that I derive guidance, help, edification from other Christians ?

We are suppose to be [b] imitators of those who are inheriting the precious promises. We should emulate them a ...[text shortened]... k of Acts ?

I know lots of healthy brothers and sisters that I do well to follow, to imitate.[/b]

You are copying the wrong man.
Nothing you say or teach demonstrates that your doctrine is of Christ.

Originally posted by sonship

Speak from the Bible instead from some mans doctrine which you adopted
and then maybe people will listen to you.,
Right now they dont.

Are you jealous that I derive guidance, help, edification from other Christians ?

We are suppose to be [b] imitators of those who are inheriting the precious promises. We should emulate them a ...[text shortened]... k of Acts ?

I know lots of healthy brothers and sisters that I do well to follow, to imitate.[/b]

Im so jealous.

Originally posted by Rajk999
Im so jealous.

Then why not look to Jesus ... for healing ?

Originally posted by Rajk999
You are copying the wrong man.
Nothing you say or teach demonstrates that your doctrine is of Christ.

What particular man are you referring to ?

Originally posted by sonship
Then why not look to Jesus ... for healing ?

Yeah .. I want to be just like you.
- make long nonsensical posts that are unbiblical
- make false conclusions contrary to the bible
- bore and annoy people with incorrect doctrines
Oh yeah .. I want to be just like you.

Originally posted by sonship
What particular man are you referring to ?

You mean you idolize more than one?
You are a sicko

Originally posted by Rajk999

I do intend to continue pray and confess in my reading the Scriptures. I do.

I think its you that needs to read more prayerfully and
- ask God to stop you from being such a sycophant and stop adoring this man whom you have placed on a pedestal.

I don't really understand that whenever you fail to give an effective rebuttal, you turn instead to name calling and saying I am following too much someone else.

Your standard fall back is telling that you really have trouble countering my supposed wrong teaching with better interpretations.

Do you think some people will not notice that ?

- ask God to help you take the teachings of Christ and the Apostles as it is written without superimposing your own false doctrine over it

Okay.
Does that mean that I won't recognize healthy teaching when I see it ?

Did I tell you about the author of Hebrews saying that such servants of God as are leading us well, it is good to hold in high esteem ?

" Remember the ones leading you, who have spoken to you the word of God; and considering the issue of their manner of life, imitate their faith." (HEBREWS 13:7)

Oh, I'm sorry. Does your translation say "Don't put ANYBODY up on a pedestal" ?

If I find that your teaching is healthy and your manner of life worthy of imitating, I'll honor you as well.

Although I dont think God helps people whose heart and mind is already twisted, and who dont care to change. Those who belligerently continue with their own doctrine which includes trivializing sin and evil are fit for nothing but the dung heap.

You're just insulting me.
Nothing much here.

Now you think you have a point about using Ephesians 5 quote, that Christ will cleanse his church. But if you read a few verses before you will see that the process of cleansing the church is by casting sinful Christians Saints OUT OF THE KINGDOM OF GOD.

There is a relationship between the church and the kingdom.
Notice it doesn't say anyone was cast out of the church.

Nothing I said about Ephesians 5 makes untrue exhortations anywhere ELSE in the same book.

Thats the method. Read it. Christians who continue with sin and evil, will not necessarily be forgiven and cleansed, but will be removed from the Kingdom Got that ?

I get suffer loss and saved yet so as through fire. (1 Cor. 3:15)

I did get a lot of help in this from brother Witness Lee. Now before I did I intuitively felt that grace could be cheap. I was still very fleshy and always confessing the same sins over and over again. Somehow in my heart I knew that God could not be that unwise to allow be to be saved and continue to live in the flesh.

But I didn't have much scriptural grounding to support what I felt must be the case.
Brother Witness Lee helped me to see the Bible passages which confirmed what i felt intuitively in my conscience.

But this is one of the men you whine that I should not esteem highly.
That doesn't make much sense.

Originally posted by sonship
I do intend to continue pray and confess in my reading the Scriptures. I do.

I think its you that needs to read more prayerfully and
- ask God to stop you from being such a sycophant and stop adoring this man whom you have placed on a pedestal.

I don't really understand that whenever you fail to give an effective rebuttal, you turn ...[text shortened]... is is one of the men you whine that I should not esteem highly.
That doesn't make much sense.

More nonsense.

Back to how all this started.

You made a statement which presumably you got from the Bible.
I asked for some support from the Bible.
You provided nothing.

Thats it. You do that all the time.
You have a bunch of false doctrines in your head.
This is caused by you following the teachings of men.
If your doctrine was of God then everything you say would be in the Bible.