Lack of accurate knowledge....

@secondson said

Apparently the object of your faith failed you. Obviously yours was a false faith, and you hadn't really been "born again" and baptized into Christ by the Holy Spirit because if you had you would never have "lost your faith".

You had religious faith and not Jesus' faith. I know you put little stock in the veracity of scripture, but Ephesians 2:8 says that faith is the ...[text shortened]... e Son of God,.." respectively.

You needed, and still do obviously, the "faith of the Son of God".

Wait a second. Anyone who has lost their faith couldn't have had a genuine faith, just a false faith? Are you sure about that?

Just taking John the Baptist as an example. Here we have a man confident in his faith, declaring assuredly, ”Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!" and yet when in prison lost this faith and questioned if Jesus was 'really' the Messiah. (Sent his disciples to ask Jesus if he was the one).

Was John the Baptists original faith a 'false faith?'

@fmf said
I used to be a Christian with strong faith, whose life was permeated by it, and whose life involved acting upon it as if it were objective truth.

Most of your responses to these facts seem to be some kind of virtue signalling about how strong and permeating your own faith is.

Your intended audience appears to be fellow Christians and not me. It doesn't make for very good c ...[text shortened]... ok back on that part of your life when you were a believer and speak about it as honestly as I have.

Well then, if a discussion about what we believe, and sharing our thoughts, ideas, opinions and perspectives isn't or doesn't meet with your concept of what a spirituality debate forum should be, and if you think you need to assume a defensive posture and presume to make psychological observations about me "stressing"..."over and over again how certain I feel...", then that's your prerogative.

But I find it illogical for you to claim to have had faith and say you "lost" it. That's not biblical faith.

I just can't find the concept of "lost faith" or "losing faith" anywhere in the New Testament.

I think the faith you lost was a faith based in human reasoning, which it appears is your only recourse in a discussion with regards to spirituality.

The above is not a criticism of you personally, but of the nature of your perspective.

@fmf said
Why would I put any stock in it all?

Because it's the truth.

@fmf said
I believe Jesus has been stone dead for 2,000 years. I do not believe he "failed" me. I don't think he has "failed" anyone. Your belief that he is still somehow still "alive" and interacting with you in someway is on you, it's not on him. He's gone and all that is left are his teachings. I do not see how Jesus has "failed" me.

You made my point. Your faith was in a dead Jesus, as it appears you came to learn.

Your faith was false. It failed you.

You claim to have had faith. I'm assuming it was faith in the reality of the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Then you appear to have learned that the resurrection wasn't a reality at all.

With that kind of fickleness how do you know you won't change your mind again?

@ghost-of-a-duke said
Wait a second. Anyone who has lost their faith couldn't have had a genuine faith, just a false faith? Are you sure about that?

Just taking John the Baptist as an example. Here we have a man confident in his faith, declaring assuredly, ”Look, the Lamb of God, who takes away the sin of the world!" and yet when in prison lost this faith and questioned if Jesus was 're ...[text shortened]... disciples to ask Jesus if he was the one).

Was John the Baptists original faith a 'false faith?'

You got it wrong ghostly guy.

John the Baptist hadn't lost his faith in God or the coming of the messiah.

But you raise a good question. I think the short answer to a complicated issue is that John the Baptist hadn't lost his faith in the faithfulness of God to fulfill His promise of a savior, but began to question whether or not Jesus was the one.

John the Baptist wavered as would anyone in similar circumstances. It cannot be justifiably said that he lost his faith.

But he did lose his head for his faith.

@secondson said
I find it illogical for you to claim to have had faith and say you "lost" it. That's not biblical faith.

It was faith in the Bible. It was faith in Jesus Christ. It was faith in God. You can call that "not biblical faith" if you so choose.

@secondson said
I just can't find the concept of "lost faith" or "losing faith" anywhere in the New Testament.

So?

@secondson said
You made my point. Your faith was in a dead Jesus, as it appears you came to learn.

Well, I am not a Christian, and I don't believe in Jesus, if that's what you're getting at. Is that "your point" that you think I've made?

@secondson said
You claim to have had faith. I'm assuming it was faith in the reality of the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Then you appear to have learned that the resurrection wasn't a reality at all.

Yes, it was faith in the reality of the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Yes. Among other things. That is what it was.

@secondson said
With that kind of fickleness how do you know you won't change your mind again?

I'm not sure that "fickleness" is the right word. My loss of faith was a long drawn out process characterized by plenty of deep contemplation, long conversations and soul searching. A gradual process leading to the realization that the faith was lost. "Fickleness"? Mmm. I see what you are trying to achieve by tossing the word into our conversation, but I think it sounds a bit crass for you to do so.

@secondson said
With that kind of fickleness how do you know you won't change your mind again?

how do you know you won't change your mind again?

I suppose I don't know if I will or I won't. What harm would it do to anyone if, say, I "changed my mind" - again - and became a Christian again? So what if I did?

@secondson said
Your faith was in a dead Jesus, as it appears you came to learn.

No, it wasn't. My faith was in the notion of a living Jesus.

@galveston75 said
Of course. But lots of changes have to be made and the bible gives no indication that they will.

Which ones?

Why do they have to make changes?

@secondson said
You claim to have had faith. I'm assuming it was faith in the reality of the resurrection of Jesus Christ. Then you appear to have learned that the resurrection wasn't a reality at all.

With that kind of fickleness how do you know you won't change your mind again?

What I perceive as being real now does not affect what I perceived as being real in the past.

@secondson said
Well then, if a discussion about what we believe, and sharing our thoughts, ideas, opinions and perspectives isn't or doesn't meet with your concept of what a spirituality debate forum should be, and if you think you need to assume a defensive posture and presume to make psychological observations about me "stressing"..."over and over again how certain I feel...", then that's your prerogative.

What "defensive posture" are you referring to?

Pointing out that your responses to the facts of my former life as a Christian seem to be more a kind of virtue signalling regarding how strong and permeating [and permanent] you think your own faith is ~ rather than a genuine attempt to accept and engage the idea that strong and affecting faith can be lost ~ is not a "defensive posture" on my part.