My President

Originally posted by josephw
You're projecting your bias.

I'm an American, and proud of it. This is the greatest nation on earth in spite of all the garbage that's spread around about it.

But in my opinion America is on the decline because of liberalism.

Thanks to 50 years of liberalism being taught in our schools we now have enough people dumbed down enough to vote for a socia ...[text shortened]... says by Tom Petty, "you can back me up against the gates of hell, but I won't back down."

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Like the song says by Tom Petty, "you can back me up against the gates of hell, but I won't back down."
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If you're complaining about the dumbing down of education in America, I would think you would quote someone more sophisticated
then Tom Petty. Whose that, some Rock musician ?

Hey, where's the Jefferson ? Where's the Hamilton? Maybe the US allows you to have a dumbed down education only if you really want one.

Originally posted by jaywill
[b]==================================
Like the song says by Tom Petty, "you can back me up against the gates of hell, but I won't back down."
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If you're complaining about the dumbing down of education in America, I would think you would quote someone more sophisticated
then Tom Petty. Whose that, some Rock mu ...[text shortened]... ybe the US allows you to have a dumbed down education only if you really want one.[/b]

hi, jaywill, obviously you know I am not an American, what i do not understand, and perhaps you can enlighten me is why people feel so fervently about politics. this is something quite alien in Europe where a general apathy has set in with regard to politics and politicians in general. we have kind of come to the conclusion that politics only really benefits politicians, for if you were digging holes for a living during the republican term, what makes people think that they will be doing something different during the democrats term? really it is a phenomena for us, and finally, why are Americans so scared of socialism, do they think that it will erode their freedom, do they not want to see a fairer society, whats the deal, i ask these things in sincerity - regards Robert.

Originally posted by josephw
You're projecting your bias.

I'm an American, and proud of it. This is the greatest nation on earth in spite of all the garbage that's spread around about it.

But in my opinion America is on the decline because of liberalism.

Thanks to 50 years of liberalism being taught in our schools we now have enough people dumbed down enough to vote for a socia ...[text shortened]... says by Tom Petty, "you can back me up against the gates of hell, but I won't back down."

Jesus would approve of Socialism, and be nauseated by Capitalism. You should be proud of your fellow Americans who have embraced the move towards true Christianity.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
hi, jaywill, obviously you know I am not an American, what i do not understand, and perhaps you can enlighten me is why people feel so fervently about politics. this is something quite alien in Europe where a general apathy has set in with regard to politics and politicians in general. we have kind of come to the conclusion that politics only reall ...[text shortened]... want to see a fairer society, whats the deal, i ask these things in sincerity - regards Robert.

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hi, jaywill, obviously you know I am not an American, what i do not understand,
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I forgot.

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and perhaps you can enlighten me is why people feel so fervently about politics.
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Those who are fervent are also very vocal. Many young people are more apathetic. However, this year many many more young people voted. I think their hightened interest is related to the difficulty of times.

The fading of the so-called "American Dream" for many has, I think, caused a hightened interest. As for you Europeans, we in the USA hear a lot about your protests concerning Global Climate change and Globalization.



Europe has a longer history and has seen more wars. Perhaps Europeans have a slightly lessened sense of dreamy optimism. As one American Jazz singer once said "I don't worry about a thing because I know ain't nothing gonna turn our right!"

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this is something quite alien in Europe where a general apathy has set in with regard to politics and politicians in general.
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I don't know. When European youth get mobolized we often get a glimpse of it on the news.

You're probably asking this of the wrong person. I am not that politically active. This year I regarded as a historical first in the US. I came closer to activeness this year than in any other in my past.

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we have kind of come to the conclusion that politics only really benefits politicians, for if you were digging holes for a living during the republican term, what makes people think that they will be doing something different during the democrats term?
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My attitude is that the two or more party system is needed. And I think that to get it close to right you have to change from one party to another from time to time.

There is a time to be conservative and there is a time to be liberal. I don't think it is always the time to be one or the other. There needs to be balance, I think. And we need protection from each party's worst instincts.

So I welcome the switch back and forth.

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really it is a phenomena for us, and finally, why are Americans so scared of socialism, do they think that it will erode their freedom, do they not want to see a fairer society, whats the deal, i ask these things in sincerity - regards Robert.
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Some people are afraid they will lose their freedoms. Some other people feed this fear, rightly or wrongly.

Socialism to many is next to Communism, something many Americans fear.

I fear it myself. But I also fear a hysteria of Facism. Ask some other Americans. I come here mostly to talk about faith in Christ.

As the human race is now, I believe as follows:


Government is better than no government.
Good government is better than bad government.
God's government is best of all.

Originally posted by jaywill
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hi, jaywill, obviously you know I am not an American, what i do not understand,
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I forgot.

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and perhaps you can enlighten me is why people feel so fervently about politics.
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Those ...[text shortened]... ood government is better than bad government.
God's govenrment is best of all. [/b][/b]

I wrote:

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Europe has a longer history and has seen more wars. Perhaps Europeans have a slightly lessened sense of dreamy optimism. As one American Jazz singer once said [b]"I don't worry about a thing because I know ain't nothing gonna turn our right!"
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That is tongue in cheek.

I think European's are positive and active in their politics. Maybe it is the older ones primarily rather than the student age.

That changes with time.

Originally posted by jaywill
[b]=============================
Thanks to 50 years of liberalism being taught in our schools we now have enough people dumbed down enough to vote for a socialist.
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I asked this question before. Did you reply?

Where in the US Constitution does it say the United States must never have a Socialist economic ...[text shortened]... t's sake. Does the American Constitution insist that the US must never be Socialistic ? Where ?[/b]

What is a socialist economic system? Do you mean like the one in Russia?

Capitalism offers the best opportunity for all as attested by how well it works.

Thanks, but I don't want a government that controls how much money I can earn.

Get the government of my back.

Originally posted by jaywill
[b]==================================
Like the song says by Tom Petty, "you can back me up against the gates of hell, but I won't back down."
======================================

If you're complaining about the dumbing down of education in America, I would think you would quote someone more sophisticated
then Tom Petty. Whose that, some Rock mu ...[text shortened]... ybe the US allows you to have a dumbed down education only if you really want one.[/b]

If I read you right, then you missed the intent of my post.

Originally posted by darvlay
Jesus would approve of Socialism, and be nauseated by Capitalism. You should be proud of your fellow Americans who have embraced the move towards true Christianity.

I wonder if you even understand what socialism is.

Originally posted by josephw
What is a socialist economic system? Do you mean like the one in Russia?

Capitalism offers the best opportunity for all as attested by how well it works.

Thanks, but I don't want a government that controls how much money I can earn.

Get the government of my back.

lol, i had to read this twice before it actually penetrated, capitalism actually works, ummm have you been reading the news lately, any of the huge corporations, you know the banks going under ringing a bell? capitalism as it stands is almost on the brink of self destruction, unless you haven't noticed its the governments who are having to sort out the mess that you capitalists have gotten yourselves and others into, and i thought that i was deluded. what has socialism got to do with the amount of money a person can earn? or perhaps you are the sort of person who deems everything in monetary terms, you know a persons worth is determined by how much he is worth in monetary terms, this for me is the ultimate materialism, people evaluating others by the house they live in, the car they drive, the holidays they go on, tell me, how does the type of car one drives have a bearing on the type of person that is inside, does he suddenly jump into it and he become batman, then when back at the bat cave, soon as he jumps out hes back to Bruce Wayne again, so it is with those who evaluate others on a materialistic basis.

Originally posted by josephw
What is a socialist economic system? Do you mean like the one in Russia?

Capitalism offers the best opportunity for all as attested by how well it works.

Thanks, but I don't want a government that controls how much money I can earn.

Get the government of my back.

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What is a socialist economic system? Do you mean like the one in Russia?
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Not necessarily. Not unnecessarily.

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Capitalism offers the best opportunity for all as attested by how well it works.
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That may be true. My question was where did the founding fathers of US say "The United States must forever and only have a capitalist economic system. THAT is what we intended." ?

That's all. I don't think our sacred Constitution ever said that. I'm opened to be proved wrong. But you haven't done so yet.

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Thanks, but I don't want a government that controls how much money I can earn.
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Hey, that's all well and good. But ... does that mean that the Apostle Paul should not have written this?

"For because of this you also pay taxes; for they are God's officers, attending constantly to this very thing. Render to all the things due: tax to whom tax is due, custom to whom custom is due ..." (See Romans 13:6-7)


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Get the government of my back.
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I think it is a matter of how far you want to take this. If you want Anarchy, well justify it as a Christian. I assume you're a Christian.

The government is just a big company. And it has the faults of any big company.

You don't think a corporation cannot tell you where to live, what to wear, what to spend, how to think? Corporations can ride your back just as well you know ?

You don't think a General Electric or an IBM can't ride your back as well ?

Originally posted by jaywill
That's not what Genesis 1:26,27 says. [b]"So God created man ... male and female created He them ..."

God knew exactly what He was doing as always. It was Adam who was delighted and surprised to see his wife.

The surprise was not on God's part. His building up anticipation in Adam's heart was not a reflection of God improvising.[/b]

Chapter 2 in genesis

18 Yahweh God said, 'It is not right that the man should be alone. I shall make him a helper.'
19 So from the soil Yahweh God fashioned all the wild animals and all the birds of heaven. These he brought to the man to see what he would call them; each one was to bear the name the man would give it.
20 The man gave names to all the cattle, all the birds of heaven and all the wild animals. But no helper suitable for the man was found for him.
21 Then, Yahweh God made the man fall into a deep sleep. And, while he was asleep, he took one of his ribs and closed the flesh up again forthwith.
22 Yahweh God fashioned the rib he had taken from the man into a woman, and brought her to the man.
23 And the man said: This one at last is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh! She is to be called Woman, because she was taken from Man.

god didn't create woman until after he rested. and the fact that all the animals were paraded before adam and no suitable candidate was found doesn't say at all that god had a plan all along.

Originally posted by josephw
You're projecting your bias.

I'm an American, and proud of it. This is the greatest nation on earth in spite of all the garbage that's spread around about it.

But in my opinion America is on the decline because of liberalism.

Thanks to 50 years of liberalism being taught in our schools we now have enough people dumbed down enough to vote for a socia ...[text shortened]... says by Tom Petty, "you can back me up against the gates of hell, but I won't back down."

do i have to say that you must be damaged goods?

i didn't once mentioned american in my previous reply and never ever did i thought about you being or not an american when i wrote it.

i just said you were so proud about your opinion, something that all people find almost always obvious: support the one you agree with and do not support the one you don't. and then you asked my if i was an american and to find out if i am not. find out what? again i point out that there is nothing hidden in your original post. there is nothing to understand, other than the fact that you took an obviously true statement and bragged about your merits for holding it to be true.

and for your information, there is no such thing as the greatest nation. each individual has merits, each nation has ups and downs.