Spirituality
30 Apr 22
@kellyjay saidFaith is just a function of cognition, KellyJay. It isn't something supernatural. Just because you believe in something supernatural, it doesn't mean something supernatural actually happens to you simply because you believe it.
You say you once believed therefore you were a Christian because simply believing is all it takes according to you and apparently dive. If we were simply taking that as all it takes for truth and reality I would have to agree.
I do not because reality gives us the truth of definitions not the other way around, I don’t get to say I am a 21 year old of some minority so I c ...[text shortened]... st not something or someone like Christ in their lives, that was all you ever had by your admission!
11 May 22
@fmf saidSupernatural or non-supernatural, if correct, amounts to the same thing, truth.
Faith is just a function of cognition, KellyJay. It isn't something supernatural. Just because you believe in something supernatural, it doesn't mean something supernatural actually happens to you simply because you believe it.
11 May 22
@kellyjay saidWe can only speculate about such things. In, say, 1995, Christ was "in" neither of us ~ other than in the sense that we both had sincere, life-shaping, impactful faith in Christ that made us believe He was "in" us and that some sort of supernatural transformation of us had taken place as a result.
Supernatural or non-supernatural, if correct, amounts to the same thing, truth.
11 May 22
@fmf saidWe can only speculate about many things, suggesting an encounter with Jesus.
We can only speculate about such things. In, say, 1995, Christ was "in" neither of us ~ other than in the sense that we both had sincere, life-shaping, impactful faith in Christ that made us believe He was "in" us and that some sort of supernatural transformation of us had taken place as a result.
Christ is only something to speculate about means you have never met Him. If you
get hit by a car; there is no need to speculate about it; meeting the creator of the
the universe is a bigger deal than a car, and the result lasts much longer.
11 May 22
@fmf saidYeah, you deny what you had was real, and you have to deny everyone else'. You
You haven't "met" him, KellyJay. You simply have sincere, life-shaping, impactful faith in Christ that makes you believe that you have; just as it used to make me believe too.
do not know; at best, you can only speculate what others have experienced; you have
to say they are lying, deceived, or in an illusion, or you are in error.
11 May 22
@kellyjay saidI do know, KellyJay. I haven't said you are "lying". Please don't start poisoning the well. I have not claimed anyone has deceived you. I don't think "illusion" is a good synonym of "faith", so I don't use terms like illusion and delusion.
Youdo not know; at best, you can only speculate what others have experienced; you haveto say they are lying, deceived, or in an illusion, or you are in error.
@fmf saidAfter almost three decades, you have come to say every experience you have had is
After almost three decades I realized what faith in Christ really is. Yours. Mine.
all anyone can have, and nothing that is said contrary to you is possible. Is that
speculation or a hardcore fact? I have walked in Guam, Alaska, Hawaii, California,
Florida, Texas, Indiana, Israel, Mexico, Illinois, Canada, and many other places. When
I had those experiences, I didn't see you next to me to validate I did them.
How must faith do you have that you are the sole barometer for all spiritual truths?
11 May 22
@kellyjay saidNo, not "every experience", no. But I see the disingenuous thing you're trying to do with your rhetoric here. No, not "every experience", KellyJay. I am talking here about Jesus, supernaturalism, your Christian faith and my Christian faith.
After almost three decades, you have come to say every experience you have had is
all anyone can have, and nothing that is said contrary to you is possible.
@kellyjay saidWalking in the U.S. is not a supernatural experience, KellyJay, and, unless I am mistaken, you are not claiming that you have been supernaturally transformed by travelling through Guam, Alaska, Hawaii, California, Florida, Texas, Indiana, Israel, Mexico, Illinois, or Canada. Just as I don't claim that living in various places around the world has transformed me supernaturally.
I have walked in Guam, Alaska, Hawaii, California,
Florida, Texas, Indiana, Israel, Mexico, Illinois, Canada, and many other places. When
I had those experiences, I didn't see you next to me to validate I did them.
@kellyjay saidI don't deny that you have had countless "spiritual" experiences in your life stemming from your faith.
How must faith do you have that you are the sole barometer for all spiritual truths?
You don't need me to "validate" it.
Just as I don't need you to "validate" how real my faith was and how real its impacts were.
All I am pointing out to you is that faith like ours back then [and yours now] is a function of cognition pertaining to the possibility of supernatural phenomena, and not a supernatural phenomenon in and of itself.
11 May 22
@kellyjay saidAll this rhetoric from you…. but YOU know FMF and YOU know wether he was saved or not?
Yeah, you deny what you had was real, and you have to deny everyone else'. You
do not know; at best, you can only speculate what others have experienced; you have
to say they are lying, deceived, or in an illusion, or you are in error.
11 May 22
1 edit
@divegeester saidPlease, I didn't notice you giving the same lecture to fmf when he talked about no
All this rhetoric from you…. but YOU know FMF and YOU know wether he was saved or not?
one has a relationship with Christ; in reality, telling everyone what they had was false.
I agree with him; what he had is what he projects on everyone else now, not real,
his words. What he experiences in his fake belief, his fake relationship, doesn't mean
it isn't a reality in others, as he suggests, and you ignore it.