Role of Music in theism

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
yes, he equates music with spirituality and by extension religion, why wouldn't he be surprised?

And he is surprised that people who are not religious can produce sublime music? Strikes me as odd to discuss "spirituality" with someone whose understanding of the human condition is so strangely truncated.

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
Deeply. Great Music should be enough to convince a person about existence of God,that is my view.

Why would it not convince us of the existence of Santa Claus or the Tooth Fairy? Which part of music says 'God exists' in your opinion?

Originally posted by Proper Knob
[b]Great Music should be enough to convince a person about existence of God,that is my view.

I understand that, but can you elaborate. Why is the above statement your view?

What exactly do you define as 'Great Music'? What exactly makes it 'great'?[/b]

I am surprised that a musician wants me to describe ' Great Music '. Any Music that brings a tear to your eye or a lump in your throat or is evocative enough to transport you mentally to another place or another time is certainly great. It should make the World look and feel great. It is a small step then to acknowledge and thank God to have made me a human with healthy ears,is it not?

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
Vibration of air molecules as sensed by human ears is sound. Music is much more than sound. There is rhythm,melody,the words of the poetry,the appeal of the music to our innermost feelings,the rich and ancient traditions of music all these things combine to move us. Music moves animals. Why it would not affect humans?

There's a difference between being moved by something and it turning you into a moron.

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
I am surprised that a musician wants me to describe ' Great Music '. Any Music that brings a tear to your eye or a lump in your throat or is evocative enough to transport you mentally to another place or another time is certainly great. It should make the World look and feel great. It is a small step then to acknowledge and thank God to have made me a human with healthy ears,is it not?

Do you think people who don't believe in God cannot respond emotionally to evocative things? Has your life long experience made you think this? Is all this tongue in cheek?

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
I am surprised that a musician wants me to describe ' Great Music '.

Well. You have said you are surprised that he is a musician.

Originally posted by FMF
Surely music demonstrates the sublime capacity of humanity? Is your own religionist mind map and stance so entrenched that you cannot process the wonder of music without seeing it in terms of the existence of God?

Surely the sublime capacity of humanity is due to God?If not, to whom then we should thank for this?

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
Surely the sublime capacity of humanity is due to God?If not, to whom then we should thank for this?

Easy, thank the person playing the music. It was them that caused whatever you felt - nothing more

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
Surely the sublime capacity of humanity is due to God?If not, to whom then we should thank for this?

Well you are welcome to believe whatever you want. I am not a religionist, so I have no reason or wish to alter your speculations or hopes or your theories about "who" has to be "thanked", or whatever other rules or ceremonies or obligations you subscribe to. So you were being genuine when you said you were surprised that people with no religion can be musicians?

Originally posted by FMF
Well. You have said you are surprised that he is a musician.

No,I did not say that. Please do not put words in my movh.

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
No,I did not say that. Please do not put words in my movh.

Well you said "I was surprised that like proper knob,many musicians were atheists,when proper knob told me so,in one recent exchange." So you are backing away from that now?

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
I am surprised that a musician wants me to describe ' Great Music '. Any Music that brings a tear to your eye or a lump in your throat or is evocative enough to transport you mentally to another place or another time is certainly great. It should make the World look and feel great. It is a small step then to acknowledge and thank God to have made me a human with healthy ears,is it not?

Instead of thanking 'god', why don't you thank the musicians who composed and played that music?

Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
My belief says that Music being a sublime art should be able to overcome well entrenched positions in atheists' minds regarding existence of God.

Do you think that atheists or non-religionists are capable of anything creative or sublime that moves other people emotionally? Or is it just music that surprises you?

Originally posted by shavixmir
There's a difference between being moved by something and it turning you into a moron.

Do you carry/know a meter which decides the degrees of getting carried away by great music?Or you have predefined all theists as morons anyway. I am classifying all those who remain unmoved after listening to great music as either deaf or tone deaf or animals on the lower rungs of evolution.

Originally posted by FMF
Well you said "I was surprised that like proper knob,many musicians were atheists,when proper knob told me so,in one recent exchange." So you are backing away from that now?

Well, I said that it was surprising that proper knob was an atheist like many other musicians he said he knew. I never expressed any surprise about his being a musician.