Salvation

Originally posted by Coletti
[b]What a laugh! Do you know what the term "All nations" means in verse 32? ...

It means [b/all[/b] nations, not just the nation of Israel. Jews and Gentiles, all races, all peoples, all nations.

It's pathetic to see someone suggesting that Jesus only says you should treat fellow believers in a charitable and loving manner; where do you guy ...[text shortened]... ou say you have the love of Jesus when you can not see the needs around you - this is the point.

Then I guess you disagree with your Pharisee friend RBHILL who, of course, thinks he is higher than people who don't believe as he does.

RBHILL: And of course we are higher then you we are children of God

And

RBHILL: A brother (no not a black person if that is what you are thinking) is a follower of Christ not every human on Earth.

Originally posted by no1marauder
Then I guess you disagree with your Pharisee friend RBHILL who, of course, thinks he is higher than people who don't believe as he does.

RBHILL: And of course we are higher then you we are children of God

And

RBHILL: A brother (no not a black person if that is what you are thinking) is a follower of Christ not every human on Earth.

We are becasue we are Children of God we don't go around sinning all day long without confessing are sins like the unsaved do.

Originally posted by no1marauder
Then I guess you disagree with your Pharisee friend RBHILL who, of course, thinks he is higher than people who don't believe as he does.

RBHILL: And of course we are higher then you we are children of God

And

RBHILL: A brother (no not a black person if that is what you are thinking) is a follower of Christ not every human on Earth.

Look I know you don't understand what I am trying to explain to you but as a Christian we have higher moral standards then the unsaved. So I will leave it at that becaseu you do not understand.

Originally posted by RBHILL
We are becasue we are Children of God we don't go around sinning all day long without confessing are sins like the unsaved do.

RB, you sound like you need a stong dose of humility. You arrogance is anything but Christlike.

Originally posted by RBHILL
Look I know you don't understand what I am trying to explain to you but as a Christian we have higher moral standards then the unsaved. So I will leave it at that becaseu you do not understand.

Remember - Matt 5 20: For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Originally posted by DoctorScribbles
Why would God say what man ought to do if man doesn't have the capacity to choose whether he will do it?

To demonstrate our dependence on God for our salvation.

God does not take away the capacity to choose, he gives man the will to choose to do good. You can not have a will to do contrary things - both good and evil - at the same time. Either your will is to do good, or not. Otherwise it is random. The Calvinist view is good can only be done if it is God's will.

But you are not a robot - because you still have a will - the question is one of which way your will is pointing. You can't violate your own will - and the orientation of your will depends on God's will. Therefore, God is glorified by the good you do - since one can not take credit for it.

Originally posted by Coletti
To demonstrate our dependence on God for our salvation.

God does not take away the capacity to choose, he gives man the will to choose to do good. You can not have a will to do contrary things - both good and evil - at the same time. Either your will is to do good, or not. Otherwise it is random. The Calvinist view is good can only be done if it is ...[text shortened]... 's will. Therefore, God is glorified by the good you do - since one can not take credit for it.

So you are saying that nobody gets any credit for good deeds ?

Originally posted by Rajk999
So you are saying that nobody gets any credit for good deeds ?

Of course not. Since you are predestined to either do good deeds or not according to God's will why should YOU get any credit??

Originally posted by no1marauder
Of course not. Since you are predestined to either do good deeds or not according to God's will why should YOU get any credit??

Sounds that way. God gives us the capacity to choose and when we choose to do good HE says sorry no credit for you as it was MY will that you choose to do good. I now get it.

Originally posted by Rajk999
Remember - Matt 5 20: For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

The righousness taht a follower of Chirst has is Chirsts righousness.

When a believer dies a physical death God sees Christs rightousness not the persons becasue people have no rightousness but Christs rightuosness if they are saved.

Originally posted by Rajk999
RB, you sound like you need a stong dose of humility. You arrogance is anything but Christlike.

You not being a born again believer can't tell me what is christlike and what isn't tell you accept him yourself. So lets not even go there.

Originally posted by no1marauder
Then I guess you disagree with your Pharisee friend RBHILL who, of course, thinks he is higher than people who don't believe as he does.

RBHILL: And of course we are higher then you we are children of God

And

RBHILL: A brother (no not a black person if that is what you are thinking) is a follower of Christ not every human on Earth.

RBHILL understands that we are in a sense better because we have been adopted as God's children. Not that we are worthy of that honor - it is a humbling position to be in - a sinner allowed in the presence of God - only because of the sacrifice of Christ.

But there is also a change when one is saved. The mind is renewed and transformed. We recognize that we are unworthy and we no longer desire to continue sinning. It is not that we a naturally better, but we now want to be better and more loving. We become better with time by the continued renewing of our minds and hearts by the power of the Holy Spirit. So even this is by God. We are no longer slaves to sin (because the penalty of sin is removed by Christ). We are now free to love. There is a transformation of the believer from the moment he first believes during his entire lifetime. It is not because we are inherently better, but we do become better by Gods grace, and we are infinitely better of then the unbeliever.

All this can confuse unbelievers. They see us talking about sin and repentance - and think we are being judgmental. Yes - we are judging ourselves first and letting the world know they need to do the same. We don't judge the hearts of unbelievers - that is not the place of Christians. We have no business judging unbelievers - but we do help our brothers with sin - this is part of loving them. You can not have love without discipline.

The world only needs to know it is sinful and needs Jesus too. This requires no personal judgment - it's just a fact. Guess what! - you're a sinner! I don't need to judge your heart to know that, I know it because I know I am a sinner too. The only difference is by God's grace I believe in Jesus, and he is making me better so I can better serve God and love my neighbors.

Originally posted by RBHILL
The righousness taht a follower of Chirst has is Chirsts righousness.

When a believer dies a physical death God sees Christs rightousness not the persons becasue people have no rightousness but Christs rightuosness if they are saved.

So Jesus was wrong in Matthew 5:20. Thanks for sharing.

Originally posted by RBHILL
You not being a born again believer can't tell me what is christlike and what isn't tell you accept him yourself. So lets not even go there.

The "Secret Decoder Ring Theory" rides again!

Originally posted by Coletti
RBHILL understands that we are in a sense better because we have been adopted as God's children. Not that we are worthy of that honor - it is a humbling position to be in - a sinner allowed in the presence of God - only because of the sacrifice of Christ.

But there is also a change when one is saved. The mind is renewed and transformed. We recognize ...[text shortened]... I believe in Jesus, and he is making me better so I can better serve God and love my neighbors.

If you think RBHILL's mind has "been renewed and transformed" you really can't read.