Somebody help me...

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
I suggest you stop telling me what to do, what to read, what is of interest and worth perusing and where to go.

I was just making a suggestion.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
If you don't like the posts, you don't have to read them, panic over problem solved.

I was simply suggesting that your posts might be a little more pertinent if you were to read the thread before diving in with stuff about whether or not I am a "liar"... and "playing Ludo". 😕

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Respectfully, I disagree.
When we position ourselves as the faithful, essentially, we are putting ourselves in charge of our faith... putting the onus on us.
Our parts are small, really.
Our strength, smaller still.
I will not make it to the end of this life abiding in faith in Christ on the merits of my stubborn iron will.
I will abide by the graciou ...[text shortened]... han me, but I have always been fearful of losing my faith, of being rendered otherwise moribund.

So you honestly think God can stop being real for you? Jesus can be
meaningless for your salvation?
Kelly

Originally posted by FMF
You propagate adherence to "idealogical dogma" that I have successfully escaped from. When I listen to you, I get exactly what you're on about.

That is disingenuous of you. I do not propagate "idealogical dogma". That's what you think you hear. If you had listened you would have heard something else.

What you have successfully escaped from is reality in exchange for a form of idealogical dogma that fits your own worldview.

What is so odd is how you can claim to believe in the existence of God, yet are apparently void of any knowledge of God, but still insist that no one else does either. Irrational.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
I suggest you stop telling me what to do, what to read, what is of interest and worth pursuing and where to go. If you don't like the posts, you don't have to read them, panic over problem solved.

What's the matter, tired of Kelly getting all the attention?

Originally posted by divegeester
You will call him a liar rather than accept that he is a Christian who has fallen away, this is very strange considering you have posted in this thread from Hebrews describing how Christians can fall away.

What is then the difference between a Christian who has fallen away and FMF who claims to be a Christian who is no longer a Christian? What would ...[text shortened]... allen away talk like - would thay say "I still believe" or would they say "I no longer believe"?

Let me ask you a simple question, do you believe some people who claim
to be Christians actually don't know the Lord, and do not really follow Jesus?
Kelly

Originally posted by josephw
What is so odd is how you can claim to believe in the existence of God, yet are apparently void of any knowledge of God, but still insist that no one else does either. Irrational.

This is an assertion steeped in the "idealogical dogma" we have been discussing.

Originally posted by KellyJay
Let me ask you a simple question, do you believe some people who claim
to be Christians actually don't know the Lord, and do not really follow Jesus?

Of course. This could be true of any of the self-identifying Christians who post here. Just as it could be true of you. I believed I actually knew the Lord and that I was really following Jesus when I was a Christian. You believe you actually know the Lord and that you are really following Jesus ~ it's why you self-identify as a Christian.

Originally posted by FMF
Of course. This could be true of any of the self-identifying Christians who post here. Just as it could be true of you. I believed I actually knew the Lord and that I was really following Jesus when I was a Christian. You believe you actually know the Lord and that you are really following Jesus ~ it's why you self-identify as a Christian.

Listen, I get you claim you "believed", but you deny Him now.
Since you deny Him now, do you acknowledge that when you claimed you
did believe, you really didn't know him?
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
Listen, I get you claim you "believed", but you deny Him now.
Since you deny Him now, do you acknowledge that when you claimed you
did believe, you really didn't know him?
Kelly

My beliefs have changed, I have never denied it. I have said over and over and over again that I do not subscribe to the same beliefs as you. I really believed I "knew him" in much the same way ~ though maybe not exactly the same ~ as you believe you "know Him" now.

Originally posted by FMF
My beliefs have changed, I have never denied it. I have said over and over and over again that I do not subscribe to the same beliefs as you. I really believed I "knew him" in much the same way ~ though maybe not [b]exactly the same ~ as you believe you "know Him" now.[/b]

You believe now: Jesus Christ is not God's savior to the world
You believe before: Jesus Christ is God's savior to the world

If this is true, acceptable, correct!
Than according to you, what you believe now, has been true forever, even
back when you did accept it.
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
You believe now: Jesus Christ is not God's savior to the world
You believe before: Jesus Christ is God's savior to the world

If this is true, acceptable, correct!
Than according to you, what you believe now, has been true forever, even
back when you did accept it.
Kelly

What I believe now cannot alter the sincerity and perceived reality of what I believed in the past, just as what I believe now cannot alter the sincerity and perceived reality of what you currently believe ~ indeed, I do not seek to change your beliefs, just as you are not seeking to change my beliefs back to Christian ones.

Originally posted by FMF
What I believe now cannot alter the sincerity and perceived reality of what I believed in the past, just as what I believe now cannot alter the sincerity and perceived reality of what you currently believe ~ indeed, I do not seek to change your beliefs, just as you are not seeking to change my beliefs back to Christian ones.

It does not change what you did believe, but it validates or rejects the
truth of it. Since your current belief rejects what you had before, than what
you had before according to you was wrong and false.
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
It does not change what you did believe, but it validates or rejects the
truth of it. Since your current belief rejects what you had before, than what
you had before according to you was wrong and false.
Kelly

I'm an ex-Christian, if that's what you are getting at. I have never denied it.

Originally posted by FMF
I'm an ex-Christian, if that's what you are getting at. I have never denied it.

No, not what I'm getting at, I want to you describe reality for me! If you
deny Jesus Christ now, then even though you professed it in the past, that
past profession was based upon an untruth, correct if your current beliefs
are true.
Kelly