Spirituality
15 Sep 17
15 Sep 17
Originally posted by @dj2beckerYou should've added verse 19.
1 Cor 1:18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
16 Sep 17
Originally posted by @odbodI think you have a point, but what we are running into with faith with respect to God and
I think everything comes down to a balance of probability.Our present state of intellectual capability dictates that a belief in absolute fact is perhaps an unwise position to take.As and when new information becomes available,our view of existence should change?
the universe is this. We have from our perspective an endless universe, so our intellectual
capability can only take in so much, so our views are ever changing. This will remain the
case throughout all of time if we and the universe were all there were.
With God the limitless has a name, has a purpose, a plan, and has put together a design.
He has even told us that He is a sure foundation, and compares what it is without Him as
shifting sand, ever learning, but never coming to the knowledge. I think that describes
what you just said, we would be forever aware that our views will always be changing.
When the limitless speaks to the limited, what should our response be?
16 Sep 17
Originally posted by @kellyjayGiven that we both agree that our minds have limited capacity,our absolute belief in anything,including the existence of a god must have an element of doubt associated with it.It may well be the case that it is our lot to learn more yet never come to full understanding.
I think you have a point, but what we are running into with faith with respect to God and
the universe is this. We have from our perspective an endless universe, so our intellectual
capability can only take in so much, so our views are ever changing. This will remain the
case throughout all of time if we and the universe were all there were.
With God ...[text shortened]... ll always be changing.
When the limitless speaks to the limited, what should our response be?
16 Sep 17
Originally posted by @odbodI agree, which is where faith comes in.
Given that we both agree that our minds have limited capacity,our absolute belief in anything,including the existence of a god must have an element of doubt associated with it.It may well be the case that it is our lot to learn more yet never come to full understanding.
16 Sep 17
Originally posted by @odbodAcknowledged under these circumstances, "faith" is merely lucky guessing. Not a good quality of faith I reckon. However
Given that we both agree that our minds have limited capacity,our absolute belief in anything,including the existence of a god must have an element of doubt associated with it.It may well be the case that it is our lot to learn more yet never come to full understanding.
say I have a diamond in one of my closed palms and you trust me in full, because you know me quite well and you are quite sure I honor my word and I do not lie on you. In this case, you remain sceptical simply as regards whether I hold the diamond in my left or in my right palm. But, in case you neither know nor trust me, you may then choose to develop the "faith" that I really keep a diamond in one palm of mine. I 'm a hardcore atheist, but if I were a theist I would be quite sure that G-d is existent -because I would really know G-d coceptually and non-conceptually, and thus I would trust in G-d. The belief in G-d's existence must be one thousand per cent strong. You have to know and fell G-d deep down in order to believe, you have to inhale G-d and exhale G-d, otherwise it does not work my feer, dead in the ocean of deep ignorance you remain;
😵
16 Sep 17
Originally posted by @black-beetleYou realize God is not just a musing of man. Being our creator who when He was done molding us from the dust of the earth, breathed into us giving us life. The bound between us broken by our betrayal breaking faith with Him.
Acknowledged under these circumstances, "faith" is merely lucky guessing. Not a good quality of faith I reckon. However
say I have a diamond in one of my closed palms and you trust me in full, because you know me quite well and you are quite sure I honor my word and I do not lie on you. In this case, you remain sceptical simply as regards whether I ...[text shortened]... ale G-d, otherwise it does not work my feer, dead in the ocean of deep ignorance you remain;
😵
Not much about us is different now from then, we either seek and trust or not.
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17 Sep 17
Originally posted by @kellyjayIf we take as a starting point that Adam and Eve were not meant to be taken literally (bearing in mind we evolved as a species) on what grounds did mankind break faith and betray God?
You realize God is not just a musing of man. Being our creator who when He was done molding us from the dust of the earth, breathed into us giving us life. The bound between us broken by our betrayal breaking faith with Him.
Not much about us is different now from then, we either seek and trust or not.
(You probably don't like my starting point).
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17 Sep 17
Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-dukeWhat undeniable evidence do you have that contradicts the biblical account of creation?
If we take as a starting point that Adam and Eve were not meant to be taken literally (bearing in mind we evolved as a species) on what grounds did mankind break faith and betray God?
(You probably don't like my starting point).
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17 Sep 17
Originally posted by @dj2beckerDid you miss the part where I referenced evolution? (Heavily evidenced). And we were discussing Adam and Eve, rather than creation itself.
What undeniable evidence do you have that contradicts the biblical account of creation?
What undeniable corroborating evidence do you have that the bible account of Adam and Eve is accurate?
17 Sep 17
Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-dukeI take them as literal, there are a lot of things you don't take literally in scripture and things
If we take as a starting point that Adam and Eve were not meant to be taken literally (bearing in mind we evolved as a species) on what grounds did mankind break faith and betray God?
(You probably don't like my starting point).
you change the meanings of that I believe puts you in error. Such as suggesting that the
OT God is different than the NT God.
Adam and Eve broke faith with God, when Adam and Eve didn't take God at His Word
disobeying God. The consequence was now they were no longer the in the image of God,
but became less than, sinners. They got one of the things they wanted, knowledge about
good and evil, but at a cost we are still suffering.
I heard something the other day about that point in time, what gave them this knowledge?
Was it something within the fruit that altered their DNA so that they knew good and evil,
or was just because they disobeyed God, they knew evil by experiencing it, since that was
not part of their life before, only good was. So the very act of disobeying God killed them
by cutting them off of having a perfect relationship with God.