The Most Important Writing to Understand

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Did you have a question?

Yes. Why are you avoiding the scripture you asked for and which I provided you with?

Originally posted by divegeester
Yes. Why are you avoiding the scripture you asked for and which I provided you with?

Why add to or interrupt the thumping you're getting from sonship--- again, it seems?

Sometimes we see in the Bible that the sinful creature will only complain that his punishment is too severe. No thought of repentance may come forth but only a complaint to God that His punishment is unjust.

Cain was the first murderer. When he murdered his brother Abel in the second generation of mankind, God pronounced a measured discipline to him. Do you think Cain showed any sense of conviction in his conscience for his murder? He did.

" And He [God] said, What have you done ? The voice of your brother's blood is crying out to Me from the ground. And now you are cursed from the ground, which has opened its mouth to receive your brother's blood from your hand.

When you till the ground, it will no longer yield its strength to you. You will be a fugitive and a wanderer on the earth.

And Cain said to Jehovah, My punishment is greater than I can bear. Now You have driven me out this day from the face of the ground, and from Your face I will be hidden; and I will b a fugitive and a wanderer on the earth, and whoever finds me will kill me." (Genesis 4:10-14)

There is not a hint in Cain of repentance or conviction concerning his murder of his brother. His only concern is own punishment, which God dispenses to Him in a tuned measured way.

The love of God cannot be manipulated to make Him violate His righteousness.
His sympathy cannot be manipulated to get Him to permit violation of His will to go uncorrected by Him.

The pre-adamic beings that followed Satan and his angels and become the demons possessed a man as an malignant army. When Jesus came to confront them, they only cared that it was too soon for them to go to the eternal punishment.

The tone of their protest contained not a shred of repentance. They only chided the Son of God for sending them (so they thought) to be tormented before it was time.

"And behold, they [the demons] cried out, saying, What do we have to do with You, Son of God? Have You come here before the time to torment us ? " (Matt. 8:29)

"You're not fair ! We hate You. Its not time to go to the eternal punishment yet? "

The age for their conviction and repentance was long gone. Like Cain they refused to ever repent. They have nothing left to do by opposed God, stir up unclean trouble, and complain that its not time for their final eternal judgment just yet.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Why add to or interrupt the thumping you're getting from sonship--- again, it seems?

You asked for scripture and I've provided one; nothing to reply about it?

Originally posted by sonship
It says that these enemies of God will be tormented [b]"before the holy angels and before the Lamb".

I can have something occurring "before" me without me being incapable of other activities and giving attention to other things.

Your added effect is that Christ and His angels have nothing else to do forever but observe what is happening before them at that time.[/b]

Feel free to explain how it is that your version of Jesus is content to observe the most horrendous act of genocidal barbarity imaginable to man, without so much as batting an eyelid?

Originally posted by divegeester
You asked for scripture and I've provided one; nothing to reply about it?

Your consistent refusal to both read and comprehend the posts of others is just darling.
You'll have to teach that to me sometime.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Your consistent refusal to both read and comprehend the posts of others is just darling.
You'll have to teach that to me sometime.

Of course..."darling"

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Your consistent refusal to both read and comprehend the posts of others is just darling.
You'll have to teach that to me sometime.

You asked for scripture supporting the eternal torture of unbelievers and I've provided you with one. Why don't you comment on that, if you are able?

Originally posted by divegeester
Feel free to explain how it is that your version of Jesus is content to observe the most horrendous act of genocidal barbarity imaginable to man, without so much as batting an eyelid?

In this most important of writings, the Bible, we have many things that are meaningful to understand the real situation of this universe.

Some things are given in way of indications For example, there is this word in the Bible Hallelujah. This is an expression of exultant praise to God. Praise Jah !!

Do you know where this word FIRST appears in the New Testament ? Its first appearance, I think, is meaningful.

The high praise of Hallelujah first appears in the New Testament in the last book - Revelation Precisely where God's mortal enemies are being defeated, we see the exulting of high praises in shouts of Hallelujah.

The first Hallelujahs in the New Testament:

"After these things I heard as it were a loud voice of a great multitude in heaven, saying, HALLELUJAH! The salvation and the glory and the power of our God.

For true and righteous are His judgments; for He has judged the great harlot who corrupted the earth with her fornication, and He avenged the blood of His slaves at her hand. And a second time they said, HALLELUJAH! And her smoke goes up forever and ever.

And the twenty-four elders and the four living creatures fell down and worshiped God, who sits upon the throne, saying, HALLELUJAH! (Rev. 19:1-4)

1.) The salvation of God has come upon mankind.
2.) The glory and power of "our God" have defeated Satan.
3.) The true judgments and the righteous judgments of come upon " the great harlot" the apostate would be wife of Jesus who is actually the Devil's master stroke corrupting the earth to resist God's recovery of the earth.
4.) Her smoke of destruction goes up forever.
5.) The most ancient angelic beings - the "twenty-four elders" are overcome and fall down and worship God. The ancient battle of who has authority over the universe is won on behalf of their Creator God. They respond with HALLELUJAH!.
6.) The four living creatures who represent all of God's creatures, especially human beings, are also overcome with praise at these true and righteous judgments, and say "Amen, HALLELUJAH!" .

They are rejoicing because the enemies of God have been crushed and God's salvation and glory and power have finally come according to the prayer -

"Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, on earth as it is in heaven."

This is the scene of rejoicing in the total vanquishing of the forces opposing God. The evil itself is conquered at last.

Feel free to explain how it is that your version of Jesus is content to observe the most horrendous act of genocidal barbarity imaginable to man, without so much as batting an eyelid?

What I see here is the judgments of God which are "true and righteous" . Should I reject that and pick up your accusation that they are not true and not righteous judgments of God ?

" ... the most horrendous act of genocidal barbarity imaginable to man."

I don't believe Revelation 19 came out of the imagination of man. I think it is the Word of God.

Jesus too comes back as "the Word of God" (Rev. 19:13)

"And He is clothed with a garment dipped in blood [ the blood of God's enemies (Isa. 63:1-3) ], and His name is called the Word of God.

And the armies which are in heaven followed Him on white horses, dressed in fine linen, white and clean." (19:13,14)

If I follow your opinion His judgments are not true and not righteous.
Rather you say that He comes to commit horrendous genocidal barbarity.
And His armies of overcoming saints are not white and clean in their Christian testimony, but dark, soiled and dirty in their following Jesus.

Which do you think I am going to go with ?

Originally posted by divegeester
You asked for scripture supporting the eternal torture of unbelievers and I've provided you with one. Why don't you comment on that, if you are able?

I feel myself sufficiently equipped to respond to your inquiry, however...
as stated...
sonship is providing you with everything required to make a scripturally-informed decision on the topic.
The only other thing necessary at this point is your humble approach to Scripture.

Originally posted by sonship
Sometimes we see in the Bible that the sinful creature will only complain that his punishment is too severe. No thought of repentance may come forth but only a complaint to God that His punishment is unjust.

[b]Cain was the first murderer. When he murdered his brother Abel in the second generation of mankind, God pronounced a measured disciplin ...[text shortened]... ir up unclean trouble, and complain that its not time for their final eternal judgment just yet.[/b]

Typo.

This should have read -

Cain was the first murderer. When he murdered his brother Abel in the second generation of mankind, God pronounced a measured discipline to him. Do you think Cain showed any sense of conviction in his conscience for his murder? He did [NOT].

Another typo

i meant -

There is not a hint in Cain of repentance or conviction concerning his murder of his brother. His only concern is [his] own punishment, which God dispenses to [him] in a tuned and measured way.

Originally posted by sonship
Sometimes we see in the Bible that the sinful creature will only complain that his punishment is too severe. No thought of repentance may come forth but only a complaint to God that His punishment is unjust.

[b]Cain was the first murderer. When he murdered his brother Abel in the second generation of mankind, God pronounced a measured disciplin ...[text shortened]... ir up unclean trouble, and complain that its not time for their final eternal judgment just yet.[/b]

Clarification:

"And behold, they [the demons] cried out, saying, What do we have to do with You, Son of God? Have You come here before the time to torment us ? " (Matt. 8:29)


"You're not fair ! We hate You. Its not time to go to the eternal punishment yet! "

The age for their conviction and repentance was long gone. Like Cain they refused to ever repent. They have nothing left to do [but] oppose God and oppress men, stir up unclean trouble, and complain that its not time for their final eternal judgment just yet!

"And behold, they [the demons] cried out, saying, What do we have to do with You, Son of God? Have You come here before the time to torment us ? " (Matt. 8:29)

Hear what the evil spirits who were deceived to follow Satan say ?


Hell haters, I would pose a question to you.

If you die and are somehow somewhere awaiting the end of history on earth to come, and you become aware that Satan is opposing God to delay His kingdom, where will your hope be ?

I mean you see then that if God wins you and the rest of the hordes of Satan are to be judged. How will you not be driven to hope that God is defeated and Satan postpones your final judgment as long as possible ?

How will you not feel eventually compelled to root for your only hope of delaying final judgment ? You may inadvertently find you have to eventually cheer on Satan, his evil angels, the demons, and all the rebel human sinners resisting God's will.

You may find that you have no choice now but to throw your lot totally in with the Devil.
It is better to believe in Christ and side with Christ the Victor, be on the winning side.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
I feel myself sufficiently equipped to respond to your inquiry, however...
as stated...
sonship is providing you with everything required to make a scripturally-informed decision on the topic.
The only other thing necessary at this point is your humble approach to Scripture.

Stop hiding behind sonship, his long-winded support of eternal torture won't help you.

You demanded scripture and I've given you one - so you want to discuss scripture or not?