16 Dec 19
There are some of you posting in this thread that should reread the OP and get back on topic.
Stress and uncertainty relative to the truth about life after death is the focal point, and should be, of this discussion, and not a generalization of stress and uncertainty about spilt milk and crumbled cookies.
@secondson saidIn answer to the first question in the OP, which was "Regardless of what religion one adheres to, is subscribing to a theological or ideological version of what "the truth" is, a way of avoiding stress?" you suggested that only Christianity is a way of avoiding "the stress of uncertainty". Why do you think religions like Islam, Judaism and Hinduism - for example - don't help their adherents avoid stress through the certainties that they promote?
There are some of you posting in this thread that should reread the OP and get back on topic.
Stress and uncertainty relative to the truth about life after death is the focal point, and should be, of this discussion, and not a generalization of stress and uncertainty about spilt milk and crumbled cookies.
@secondson saidIn answer to the second question in the OP, which was "What exactly is the disadvantage of uncertainty about spiritual things?" your answer was "there is no "uncertainty" about the truth, as truth is embodied in the person of Jesus Christ." But don't adherents of other religions also believe "there is no uncertainty about the truth" that they believe in?
There are some of you posting in this thread that should reread the OP and get back on topic.
16 Dec 19
@fmf saidYou post in virtually every thread here -- your title is "main poster," and you happen to be the main atheist poster. How am I supposed to avoid what you are saying on a forum of this size?
Ironic advice, indeed, from someone who stalked me from thread to thread throughout 2018 and 2019 with incessant off-topic condemnations and personal remarks.
Your victim complex is very unbecoming.
@philokalia saidIt was the constant stalking and pompous off-topic browbeating I found creepy, and not the very limited number of genuine conversations you could be bothered to engage in.
You post in virtually every thread here -- your title is "main poster," and you happen to be the main atheist poster. How am I supposed to avoid what you are saying on a forum of this size?
@philokalia saidI am not a victim of anything here nor have I ever been.
Your victim complex is very unbecoming.
16 Dec 19
@fmf saidIt's disappointing but unsurprising that as soon as I've come back for even a brief series of posts you are in retreat and throwing up the victimhood claims.
It was the constant stalking and pompous off-topic browbeating I found creepy, and not the very limited number of genuine conversations you could be bothered to engage in.
If you feel overwhelmed, consider just not replying and have a nice cup of tea and savor the Boris Johnson victory for a few hours and come back when you feel fresh.
16 Dec 19
@philokalia said"Victimhood"?
It's disappointing but unsurprising that as soon as I've come back for even a brief series of posts you are in retreat and throwing up the victimhood claims.
16 Dec 19
@philokalia saidIf you're opposed to "whining", then I look forward to evidence of it.
I'm glad to hear it. It sounded an awful lot like you were whining.
@moonbus saidI've heard the term "apocaholism" coined.
I would turn the question around. "How does anyone bear it, believing that all questions have already been settled, including which people are going to Heaven?" That leads straight to fatalism.
It sometimes leads to an extraordinary blend of sanctimoniousness and impotence. There's been a fair bit of apocaholism on display in this community over the years.
When I encounter people who seem to be apocaholic, I am inclined to ask them if they were drawn to religion because it fed their fatalism, or if religion might have turned some of them into fatalists.
- Joined
- 14 Mar 15
- Moves
- 29602
16 Dec 19
@kellyjay saidI think 'delusion' is a hard way of putting it. My point was that any creature capable of comprehending their own mortality would find ways to cope with this reality, including the creation of gods to save them.
Are you suggesting that man has the mental capacity to convince himself he is merely progressing to a higher self, and that is a delusion on man's part according to you? If it is nothing but a delusion, not sure why it would matter if anyone reproduced; it isn't like it would matter one way or another in the end.
I think believing that would be a delusion, our purpose is more in the divine than it is in the evolving pond scum to self-awareness variety.
And personally I think reproducing future generations and ensuring the continuation of our species is a beautiful thing and it matters very much to me that future generations of my family continue to thrive, even if I won't be there myself to see it. (Let's call it altruistic love).
I would also ask you to resist the use of the 'scum' terminology which is actually rather insulting to our common origin and is only used in that context to belittle that explanation for the emergence of life.
16 Dec 19
@ghost-of-a-duke saidWhy wouldn't delusion be an accurate description? Any belief not grounded in truth would be made up, wouldn't it, comprehending ways to cope isn't seeking the truth, it is just attempting to make the dots fit that one thinks is required if they do or not. You are quite content suggesting the creation of gods helps people do that, I actually agree with you there.
I think 'delusion' is a hard way of putting it. My point was that any creature capable of comprehending their own mortality would find ways to cope with this reality, including the creation of gods to save them.
And personally I think reproducing future generations and ensuring the continuation of our species is a beautiful thing and it matters very much to me that ...[text shortened]... mmon origin and is only used in that context to belittle that explanation for the emergence of life.
Reproduction just for reproduction's sake seems more of self-love than anything of real importance. I'm not sure why you think scum is insulting; you have another word you'd prefer, dead dirt, remove a little moisture, and it is more to your liking? Why would it matter, why would it be insulting? You have some reason to think some ways we might have come to life from non-life is insulting, while others promote your self-image?
I can see that if there were some cause to think it mattered, but if it doesn't, why would it be insulting? I believe being divinely made makes all other stories about our existence less than and insulting! I fail to see why any possible other reasons would be more acceptable to any other, if any, could be true or false.
16 Dec 19
@kellyjay saidIs everybody in the world who does not share your personal opinions about what is "grounded in the truth" suffering from "delusion"?
Why wouldn't delusion be an accurate description? Any belief not grounded in truth would be made up, wouldn't it, comprehending ways to cope isn't seeking the truth, it is just attempting to make the dots fit that one thinks is required if they do or not.
16 Dec 19
@kellyjay saidIs loving one's children, protecting them, making sacrifices for them, and raising them so they have the skills and knowledge to find or create their own meaning in life - is that "self-love"?
Reproduction just for reproduction's sake seems more of self-love than anything of real importance.