Turn to the dark side

Originally posted by @rajk999
There is a very good argument that Satan is just a personification of sin or sin in the flesh. There is no being called Satan.

There is good and righteous ie the Light of Christ
There is opposition to Christ which is all forms of sin and evil.

I don't really exist either.

Trouble is, I'm not sure what I'm a personification of?

Any ideas?

Originally posted by @philokalia
I did not see, from the original quote, that it implied a literal theistic satanism, and Sonship has not, at any point, suggested that that was precisely what he meant.

So how did you reach that ocnclusion?

Apologies, missed this post by you, among all of Roman's trolling. (In the same way I once missed an important training email in my in-box due to all the spam about claiming for car accident injuries or buying fake passports).

Do you not think sonship's use of the term Satan 'worship' is key here? Had he said 'atheism is a temporary stop on the way to debauchery or hedonism' or 'to a life of degradation and immorality' I probably would have let it slide (though obviously not agreeing with his conclusion). But 'worship?!'

Sonship was not just talking about evil or immorality, he had personalised it as 'Satan.' He was also not talking in a generalised fashion about living a sinful life, he specifically chose the term 'worship.'

Again, coming from a biblical theist who often speaks about the reality of the fires of hell, why would anyone not taking literally his statement that atheism was a journey towards 'Satan worship?'

Originally posted by @romans1009

“The next time the devil reminds you of your past, remind him of his future.”

This is actually very effective.
And for Satan to have been defeated by a man ... a MAN ... the man Jesus.

(A God-man for sure. But a man - "the last Adam" )

What a shame to the Devil.
From what a glorious and high beginning he has fallen from to a miserable end!

And defeated by the man Jesus and the humans one with Jesus, filled up with Jesus.

"Now the God of peace will crush Satan under your feet shortly. The grace of our Lord Jesus be with you." ( Romans 16:20)

And the planet and the creation will be Christ and the church's. We who allow Christ's life to fill us and saturate us are the true environmentalists.

Through man the earth was relinquished to the Devil.
Through man being reconciled to God the meek will again inherit the earth.

Originally posted by @whodey
I don't really exist either.

Trouble is, I'm not sure what I'm a personification of?

Any ideas?

You can either be a personification of goodness and righteousness
Or you can be a personification of sin and evil.

The first group also called the sheep of Christ will enter the kingdom of God
The second, the goats, the followers of sin, will be destroyed.

You personally? I dont know. Thats between you and Christ.

Originally posted by @rajk999
You can either be a personification of goodness and righteousness
Or you can be a personification of sin and evil.

The first group also called the sheep of Christ will enter the kingdom of God
The second, the goats, the followers of sin, will be destroyed.

You personally? I dont know. Thats between you and Christ.

So now you are not sure? I thought you called me a goat, or were you in error in that judgment?

Originally posted by @whodey
So now you are not sure? I thought you called me a goat, or were you in error in that judgment?

I called you a goat because you ridicule the doctrine of Christ
which preachs good works.
That kind of comment is the type goats make.

A sheep of Christ
Hears Christ voice
They follow his commandments
They get eternal life

What type are you?

Originally posted by @rajk999
I called you a goat because you ridicule the doctrine of Christ
which preachs good works.
That kind of comment is the type goats make.

A sheep of Christ
Hears Christ voice
They follow his commandments
They get eternal life

What type are you?

I never ridiculed his teachings.

I do, however, dispute the notion that we save ourselves.

Jesus would walk up to someone who reached out to him in faith for healing, and tell them that their sins were forgiven and that just placing our faith in him is the key. Naturally, the religious leaders were outraged by this because only God can forgive sins. Then he would smile and ask them, "What is easier, to say your sins are forgiven or rise up and walk", and then heal him. Once the miracle occurred what could they say?

I suppose your position would be that these were already "good" people that really did not need Christ to make them "good", or am I wrong?

Originally posted by @whodey
I never ridiculed his teachings.

I do, however, dispute the notion that we save ourselves.

Jesus would walk up to someone who reached out to him in faith for healing, and tell them that their sins were forgiven and that just placing our faith in him is the key. Naturally, the religious leaders were outraged by this because only God can forgive sins. ...[text shortened]... e were already "good" people that really did not need Christ to make them "good", or am I wrong?

I have said nothing of the sort, and I dont know where you get that convoluted nonsensical doctrine from which is contrary to the doctrine of Christ. So you are in fact ridiculing the teachings of Christ. .. but you dont seem to know that you do that.
Here is what Christ said AGAIN :

My sheep hear my voice,
and I know them,
and they follow me:
And I give unto them eternal life;
and they shall never perish,
neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
(John 10:27-28 KJV)

Read who gets eternal life.

Maybe you need to read over your bible.

Originally posted by @rajk999
I have said nothing of the sort, and I dont know where you get that convoluted nonsensical doctrine from which is contrary to the doctrine of Christ. So you are in fact ridiculing the teachings of Christ. .. but you dont seem to know that you do that.
Here is what Christ said AGAIN :

My sheep hear my voice,
and I know them,
and they follow me: ...[text shortened]... John 10:27-28 KJV)

Read who gets eternal life.

Maybe you need to read over your bible.

Those who heed his voice are his sheep. I never disputed this.

Is it then your conclusion that the sacrifice on the cross did nothing to save us or are we in desperate need of faith in his blood to wash away our sins?

Originally posted by @whodey
Those who heed his voice are his sheep. I never disputed this.

Is it then your conclusion that the sacrifice on the cross did nothing to save us or are we in desperate need of faith in his blood to wash away our sins?

Did you understand what Jesus said here?

My sheep hear my voice,
and I know them,
and they follow me:
And I give unto them eternal life;
and they shall never perish,
neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
(John 10:27-28 KJV)

Clearly you failed basic english comprehension.

Let me know if you need further explanation.

Originally posted by @rajk999
Did you understand what Jesus said here?

My sheep hear my voice,
and I know them,
and they follow me:
And I give unto them eternal life;
and they shall never perish,
neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
(John 10:27-28 KJV)

Clearly you failed basic english comprehension.

Let me know if you need further explanation.

Did his sheep require him to come die on a cross so that they could be made right with God?

Why can you not answer this question?

Originally posted by @whodey
Did his sheep require him to come die on a cross so that they could be made right with God?

Why can you not answer this question?

I will answer any question that bears some relevance to what we are discussing.
Why are you asking me to answer a question that Jesus did not comment on.

Please show me where Jesus discussed this issue of his death which you are raising.

It seems that you are attempting to derail the point Jesus makes about his sheep.

Was he not clear?

Originally posted by @rajk999
I will answer any question that bears some relevance to what we are discussing.
Why are you asking me to answer a question that Jesus did not comment on.

Please show me where Jesus discussed this issue of his death which you are raising.

It seems that you are attempting to derail the point Jesus makes about his sheep.

Was he not clear?

Whats the matter now Whodey?

All along you are answering within 2 or 3 minutes and as soon as I ask about where Jesus makes these statements you disappear ... only to reappear in a few days and make the same stupid statements, in another thread ... pathetic.

Originally posted by @rajk999
You can either be a personification of goodness and righteousness
Or you can be a personification of sin and evil.

The first group also called the sheep of Christ will enter the kingdom of God
The second, the goats, the followers of sin, will be destroyed.

You personally? I dont know. Thats between you and Christ.

Thats it ay

Only whodey can row his boat

I said that (on a world wide historical sense) atheism is just a temporary stop traveling from theism to Satan worship.

By examining the end time prophecies in Revelation, mostly, I notice this. The whole world that rejects God end up worshiping a man to whom Satan has given his evil authority and world empire. And they worship Satan.

Now, I will speak about the individual Atheist experience. But it is here I employ my rational imagination towards something I gather from reading the Bible.

I could be wrong about this. But I think that if an Atheist dies he will immediately realize that he is on the wrong side of the issue of God's existence. But he also may realize that the final judgment for his position is being held up, postponed, delayed AS LONG as this being Satan can forestall God from accomplishing His will on the earth.

It seems to me that the atheist will end up rooting for the Devil more than for God in that state of being in Hades. At least as long as Satan can interfere with God's will on earth the last judgment will be postponed.

So he will find himself inadvertently hoping the delay of Satan's opposition to God lasts as long or indefinitely as possible. He ends up putting his trust in Satan.

Do I have any biblical bases for this ? Perhaps I do in the fact that the demons argued with Christ that He could not come "before the time" to pass final judgment on them.

"And behold, they [the legion of demons] cried out, saying,

What do we have to do with You, Son of God? Have You come here before the time to torment us?" (Matt. 8:29)

1.) They are not happy as they are.
2.) They know greater unhappiness awaits them.
3.) Their only wish is that DELAY would continue so as to postpone that time.

I have a theory that in the realm of death, the souls of the rejectors of Christ's salvation will neither be happy nor have hope. They may end up in that state of interim soul existence, rooting and cheering Satan on because he alone is the opposition source of the putting off of their final judgment.

This is a theory. And I could be wrong.