14 Nov 12
Originally posted by FMFAnd please explain to what extent this shunning is applied? Do you know all the details of what is allowed in our everyday interactions with someone of the same family that is not only a mionr but that is still living under the parents roof?
galveston75 has talked several times on this forum about how he shunned his own child in the past for religious reasons.
Are you unaware of the JW organisation's use of concerted shunning to punish and ostracize dissenters?
If you don't see institutionalized shunning of family and former friends as "psychological bullying" then that is a matter for you.
Please explain all the facts on this that you know?
14 Nov 12
1 edit
Originally posted by galveston75Does this question to me mean you reckon you've now dodged my question once and for all? You know the one: about whether the instruction you perceive there to be the scriptures that you engage in psychological bullying, such as shunning or concerted ostracism, supersedes the morality of tolerance, humility and generosity of spirit towards others?
Please explain all the facts on this that you know?
15 Nov 12
Originally posted by FMFYou really like those big words don't ya? Anyway answer my simple question about all you know on this subject that you think we are so bullyish about?
Does this question to me mean you reckon you've now dodged my question once and for all? You know the one: about whether the instruction you perceive there to be the scriptures that you engage in psychological bullying, such as shunning or concerted ostracism, supersedes the morality of tolerance, humility and generosity of spirit towards others?
15 Nov 12
Originally posted by galveston75You think "ostracism" is a big word? I see institutionalized and concerted shunning as bullying, yes. Scientologists use it too. There is plenty of testimony about how the JWs use it. Plenty of testimony from victims. I had friends back in the U.K. who were victims of it, as you well know, I've discussed that here before. So, you have decided not to answer the point blank question about tolerance, humility and generosity of spirit towards others?
You really like those big words don't ya? Anyway answer my simple question about all you know on this subject that you think we are so bullyish about?
15 Nov 12
Originally posted by FMFSo would you shun a murderer that shows no remorse?
You think "ostracism" is a big word? I see institutionalized and concerted shunning as bullying, yes. Scientologists use it too. There is plenty of testimony about how the JWs use it. Plenty of testimony from victims. I had friends back in the U.K. who were victims of it, as you well know, I've discussed that here before. So, you have decided not to answer the point blank question about tolerance, humility and generosity of spirit towards others?
15 Nov 12
Originally posted by galveston75If the murderer was a relative or somebody who had been close, I doubt I would shun them even if they showed no remorse. I imagine I would visit them in prison.
I asked you the question. Answer it or be done with this conversation.
Are you still just intent on blanking out my question about tolerance, humility and generosity of spirit towards others?
15 Nov 12
Originally posted by FMFWell that would be your decision. If that person were free to move around in society and even come to your house for dinner, I truly hope you would shun him but who knows.
If the murderer was a relative or somebody who had been close, I doubt I would shun them even if they showed no remorse. I imagine I would visit them in prison.
Are you still just intent on blanking out my question about tolerance, humility and generosity of spirit towards others?
Another scene for you then. You have children, so would you shun a known child molester or would you be ok with that person being around your family?
If you knew of a person that was a thief, would you let your family and children associate with them?
15 Nov 12
1 edit
Originally posted by galveston75Your attempted thought-game involves asking whether I would shun "murderer that shows no remorse" who was "free to move around in society and even come to [my] house for dinner"?
Well that would be your decision. If that person were free to move around in society and even come to your house for dinner, I truly hope you would shun him but who knows.
I wonder how often you use thought-games like this to shore up your 'certainty' about your own moral righteousness.
15 Nov 12
Originally posted by galveston75I would report a person I suspected of being a child molester to the police. My children would have no reason to associate with a stranger who was a suspected child molester nor would a stranger be "around my family". One cannot "shun" someone one does not know. If a friend or relative was a suspected child molester I would not shun them. Surely it is a situation in which that friend or relative needs the counsel of those who know him and care?
Another scene for you then. You have children, so would you shun a known child molester or would you be ok with that person being around your family?
Would this be another typical example of an orchestrated JW shunning? i.e. against a JW who was "a known child molester" but showed no remorse, like the JW murderer?
15 Nov 12
2 edits
galveston75,
Are you planning to simply ignore my question about whether your obligations with regard to tolerance, humility and generosity of spirit towards others are somehow trumped by the "instruction" you claim there is for you - and your organisation, collectively, concertedly - to shun people for religious reasons?
15 Nov 12
Originally posted by FMFWould it not be your decision too?
If the murderer was a relative or somebody who had been close, I doubt I would shun them even if they showed no remorse. I imagine I would visit them in prison.
Originally posted by galveston75
Well that would be your decision.
Would you not visit a relative who was in prison for a serious crime?
Would you be allowed to visit them by your organisation?