21 Apr 13
Originally posted by no1marauderI saw all of the games in Phoenix. To say that the USA team was an allstar team was a
I've watched the WBC all three times and there didn't seem to be much difference between the talent levels of the top Japanese players and the top American ones. True, it's an All-Star team but so were everybody else's.
Of course, the MLB has a significant portion of non-Americans (close to 30😵, so talking about the MLB team as "our" team ...[text shortened]... team would sweep oh 90% of the time and win by an average of 10-1 every game? Or what?
real stretch. Yes, they had some all star caliber players on the team. On the entire
roster the only true all star caliber hitters were Joe Mauer. Brandon Phillips Jimmy Rollins,
David Wright and Ryan Braun. Adam Jones and Giancarlo Stanton are mediocre
compared to other talent we could have pulled. As far as pitching, we only had RA Dickey,
Gio Gonzales and Craig Kimbrel. Detwiler is an up and comer, but there were many
better pitchers we could have had. In short, if we brought the best we had (as the other
countries did), we would have blown them all away if the games meant something to
the players. Most of them were trying to stay healthy for the season and get in shape.
I also think you misunderstood about calling MLB "our team". That was never stated.
What was stated was the gall of MLB calling it the World Championship of baseball.
My position is, the MLB champion would blow any other team in the world away
consistently. They would not win every game, but the would win the preponderance,
my guess being at least 80% of the time.
In regard to the MLB vs Japan proposition, are you going to have the Japanese League
Champion play the MLB Champion? If so, then if the games were played in MLB
stadiums, the MLB teams win, on average 4 games to 1. If the games we played in
Japan, the MLB wins on average 4 games to 2. The difference being the fence depths
of the two leagues. Let's face it, my Boomer Wells and Tuffy Rhodes examples show
the Japanese stadiums are bandboxes and the pitching is not overpowering.
21 Apr 13
1 edit
Originally posted by shortcircuitThis is a preposterous post. Adam Jones was an All-Star last year, won a Gold Glove and finished 6th in the AL MVP voting. Giancarlo Stanton led the NL in slugging in 2012. "Mediocre"? You need to buy a dictionary.
I saw all of the games in Phoenix. To say that the USA team was an allstar team was a
real stretch. Yes, they had some all star caliber players on the team. On the entire
roster the only true all star caliber hitters were Joe Mauer. Brandon Phillips Jimmy Rollins,
David Wright and Ryan Braun. Adam Jones and Giancarlo Stanton are mediocre
compared odes examples show
the Japanese stadiums are bandboxes and the pitching is not overpowering.
The Wells and Rhodes examples are ancient history that don't "prove" anything.
As to stadium dimensions, your information is wrong or outdated:
Typical dimensions are 309-320 feet down the lines, 340-350 feet to straightaway right or left, 360-365 feet to the gaps, and 400 to dead center. A typical fence is 13 feet high.
That might be slightly shorter than many (though not all MLB parks) but it doesn't seem particularly "bandbox" to me (and the walls are significantly higher). It's about the same as Tropicana Field which is not considered a hitter's park (Japanese stadiums are domed so you don't get wind factors).
Of course, then you conclude by saying a series would be competitive!🙄
21 Apr 13
Originally posted by no1marauderAre you saying if you got to choose two outfielders from MLB your choices would be
This is a preposterous post. Adam Jones was an All-Star last year, won a Gold Glove and finished 6th in the AL MVP voting. Giancarlo Stanton led the NL in slugging in 2012. "Mediocre"? You need to buy a dictionary.
The Wells and Rhodes examples are ancient history that don't "prove" anything.
As to stadium dimensions, yo ...[text shortened]...
Of course, then you conclude by saying a series would be competitive!🙄
Adam Jones and Giancarlo Stanton? I sincerely doubt you would. I know I wouldn't.
Ancient history? How many "proven quality" power hitter are there in the Japanese
League who could tee it up in the MLB?
Winning 4 games to 1 and 4 games to 2 is not very competitive.
The only reason I gave two wins in their home parks.
21 Apr 13
Originally posted by shortcircuitThere was 1 better CF in the AL than Jones based on last year's performance. There was no clearly better RF in the NL than Stanton. That doesn't equate to "mediocre".
Are you saying if you got to choose two outfielders from MLB your choices would be
Adam Jones and Giancarlo Stanton? I sincerely doubt you would. I know I wouldn't.
Ancient history? How many "proven quality" power hitter are there in the Japanese
League who could tee it up in the MLB?
Winning 4 games to 1 and 4 games to 2 is not very competitive.
The only reason I gave two wins in their home parks.
Your theory about there being a big difference in the home parks is refuted by the figures I gave. If that is the basis for your claim of a lopsided advantage to MLB players over and above the Japanese leagues, it's counter-factual.
22 Apr 13
Originally posted by no1marauderI would replace those two with Trout and Harper.
There was 1 better CF in the AL than Jones based on last year's performance. There was no clearly better RF in the NL than Stanton. That doesn't equate to "mediocre".
Your theory about there being a big difference in the home parks is refuted by the figures I gave. If that is the basis for your claim of a lopsided advantage to MLB players over and above the Japanese leagues, it's counter-factual.
You are entitled to your opinion, but it doesn't mean you are correct.
I will stand by my analysis.
The biggest problem with the WBC, aside from it being an exhibition, is that the US simply does not send its best pitchers.
Of the 2013 team, only RA Dickey and Gio Gonzales were among the best pitchers in baseball last year.
No Clayton Kershaw. No Justin Verlander. No David Price. No Matt Cain. No Jered Weaver. No Cliff Lee. No Chris Sale, etc.
Derek Hernandez is 19-25 for his career with a 4.01 ERA in the NL. Ross Detwiler is 17-23. Mitchell Boggs is 29 years old with 13 wins on his major league resume.
These are simply not the best pitchers the USA has to offer.
Show me a real series in October with a rotation of Verlander, Price, Kershaw and Cain or Zimmerman or Sale or Sabbathia for that matter and Johnson, Nathan and Papelbon coming out of the pen with the winner getting crowned as a real champion. If the other teams can beat that team, then I'll be impressed.
25 Apr 13
Originally posted by sh76My point precisely.
The biggest problem with the WBC, aside from it being an exhibition, is that the US simply does not send its best pitchers.
Of the 2013 team, only RA Dickey and Gio Gonzales were among the best pitchers in baseball last year.
No Clayton Kershaw. No Justin Verlander. No David Price. No Matt Cain. No Jered Weaver. No Cliff Lee. No Chris Sale, etc.
Derek ...[text shortened]... ting crowned as a real champion. If the other teams can beat that team, then I'll be impressed.
Also, we could have found many 1B better than the one we used.
This wasn't close to our best team.
25 Apr 13
Originally posted by sh76Do you think the San Francisco Giants are the current World Champions?
The biggest problem with the WBC, aside from it being an exhibition, is that the US simply does not send its best pitchers.
Of the 2013 team, only RA Dickey and Gio Gonzales were among the best pitchers in baseball last year.
No Clayton Kershaw. No Justin Verlander. No David Price. No Matt Cain. No Jered Weaver. No Cliff Lee. No Chris Sale, etc.
Derek ...[text shortened]... ting crowned as a real champion. If the other teams can beat that team, then I'll be impressed.
25 Apr 13
Originally posted by sh76It's a reasonable hypothesis that the San Francisco Giants of 2012 would have won a series against the Japanese champions. It was also a reasonable hypothesis that the Soviets would win the Olympic Gold medal in hockey in 1980 or that the New England Patriots would finish their unbeaten season with a rousing victory in the Super Bowl.
Yes, I do.
The MLB draws top talent from around the world and is the top league in the world. Therefore, its champion can reasonably be called world champion.
Sometimes funny things happen when you actually play the games.