America, too big to fail?

Originally posted by kmax87
What if all the stimulus and faith in the market regaining confidence and rebounding fails to realise and that great centre of capitalism the US, and Wall Street in particular falls under the weight of their own ponzi greed, will the rest of us survive? Or is America banking on the idea that they are to big to fail?

Debate!

The answer is easy, the first order of business is to come up with another dollar consuming entitlement program via universal health care. Once this is done, we can talk but not until then!! 😠

Originally posted by xnomanx
I'm not even coming from a pro-U.S. standpoint...but if you look at the numbers, the size of the military, etc., it's hard to see how the U.S. wouldn't find a way to come out on top of any crash that hits.

What does the military have to do with it? Surely the US's large military is nothing more than a drain when it comes to economics? If China decided to pull out of the US and sell all its dollars, would the US attack China militarily?
After China pulled out of the US, which country would have the larger GDP? (remember that the dollar would devalue - lowering the US's GDP).
Which country would suffer a greater economic drop?

Originally posted by sh76
===America, too big to fail? ===

Probably.

But, more importantly, how would you define "fail"?

Is 25% unemployment a failure? 200% inflation in 5 years? Armed revolution? Another loss in the next World Baseball Classic?

The US Government is not going to declare Chapter 11; they can just print money. So, we need to know what it means for a country to fail.

That is a good question. On one hand there is a system emerging where people can not support themselves. On the other is a strong economy killing the environment. There must be middle ground somewhere. Numbers by themselves are hard to use for a definition of failure as you pointed out. So I will give my 2 cents worth here. We have failed if we have to go to a socialist system of govt. We have failed if we lose our freedom. We have failed if our liberty is lost. We have failed if we have sold off the countries assets to foreign interests and powers. We can get money back with hard work and strong competitive spirit. It is much more difficult now that the economy is so global oriented. What did we think was going to happen when we went global to the degree we did? The poor nations standard of living will rise and ours will decline until some equilibrium is reached. We still have a long drop ahead for us until we give up globalism.

Originally posted by joe beyser
We have failed if we have sold off the countries assets to foreign interests and powers.

My understanding was that a large proportion of the US mortgage market was foreign owned. What other assets are you referring to and what proportion constitutes failure?

Originally posted by twhitehead
My understanding was that a large proportion of the US mortgage market was foreign owned. What other assets are you referring to and what proportion constitutes failure?

I was just making a point that we are in the process of failing now. I have no numbers but american corporations, highway infrastructure, ports, national parks, and real estate in general come to mind. For me, loosing what makes the country so enjoyable to live here is a big indicator. We should never sell off our assets and give other nations power over us. I know it is easy to say in hind sight, but we can consider it a lesson learned and avoid future bungling.

Originally posted by kmax87
What if all the stimulus and faith in the market regaining confidence and rebounding fails to realise and that great centre of capitalism the US, and Wall Street in particular falls under the weight of their own ponzi greed, will the rest of us survive? Or is America banking on the idea that they are to big to fail?

Debate!

Yeah... I don't think the Goliathian size of the US is gonna help her one bit.
Didn't help the Greeks, didn't help the Romans, didn't help the Germans, the English, the Dutch, the Portugese, the Spanish...

Originally posted by shavixmir
Yeah... I don't think the Goliathian size of the US is gonna help her one bit.
Didn't help the Greeks, didn't help the Romans, didn't help the Germans, the English, the Dutch, the Portugese, the Spanish...

You could add to the list Jabba the Hut and Fat Bastard.

Originally posted by whodey
You could add to the list Jabba the Hut and Fat Bastard.

I don't see what any of my ex's have to do with this.

Originally posted by joe beyser
I was just making a point that we are in the process of failing now. I have no numbers but american corporations, highway infrastructure, ports, national parks, and real estate in general come to mind. For me, loosing what makes the country so enjoyable to live here is a big indicator. We should never sell off our assets and give other nations power over ...[text shortened]... is easy to say in hind sight, but we can consider it a lesson learned and avoid future bungling.

It depends on how you look at it. The US has done rather well by selling of its assets (called foreign investment) and borrowing from other countries to fund its government. It is true that borrowing too much is dangerous (as most people in the US seem to have at last realized) but borrowing is nevertheless extremely beneficial. I know because I come from a country where credit and mortgages did not exist until recently. Every car or house I bought had to be paid for in full up front.