Hands up who believes in the potential threat......
A lot of americans on this site so this should be interesting!
An interesting case in point is the recent Baffin island Inuit lawsuit against the US state for damage to their environment and human rights by US carbon emissions. Sounds far fetched but it could be a landmark case if it goes to trial....
Some economists have called externalisation of costs onto the environment a form of inter-generational tyranny, in the form of taxation without representation on our childrens resources.
The link between basic human rights issues and the global and local environment is irrefutable, it goes to the core of our social value system. Why is the environment not higher on the global-political-economic agenda?!
All thoughts welcome.......
Originally posted by TomPBelieve it or not, but Americans are just as concerned as Europeans about global warming; it's just that some of us want to observe it happening from the driver's side of a Hummer.....face it, we're all doomed in about 50-100 years....the Inuits had better include China and India as defendants in that lawsuit....toss Europe an invite too.....we're all to blame for this travesty
Hands up who believes in the potential threat......
A lot of americans on this site so this should be interesting!
An interesting case in point is the recent Baffin island Inuit lawsuit against the US state for damage to their environment and human rights by US carbon emissions. Sounds far fetched but it could be a landmark case if it goes to ...[text shortened]... ronment not higher on the global-political-economic agenda?!
All thoughts welcome.......
Originally posted by chancremechanicThere is a window for action. We could vote for green political representatives, but people don't. Not on either side of the Atlantic. The reason being that it would be considered by most to be a wasted vote! Wasted chance more like..... so how did you vote? Feel free just to say 'not green' if youre embarassed about voting Republican.
Believe it or not, but Americans are just as concerned as Europeans about global warming; it's just that some of us want to observe it happening from the driver's side of a Hummer.....face it, we're all doomed in about 50-100 years....the Inuits had better include China and India as defendants in that lawsuit....toss Europe an invite too.....we're all to blame for this travesty
Originally posted by TomPLook, I hate Republicans and Democrats; I hate politicians period! Whether they are on the left side of the Atlantic or right side, they all suck balls! I'm not familiar with the Greens, but if they can save the planet without sending the world into a Depression, or if they can prevent the American economy from going to hell in a handbasket, I'm all for it. How are you going to tell the growing Chinese middleclass, growing by the millions annually, that they have to continue using rickshaws and bicycles instead of driving Benzes or BMWs; how are you going to tell the Indians that they have to keep riding elephants and bicycles instead of driving cars...LOL...?Technology is either going to save us or destroy us. We can't have it both ways. We need a "Manhatten Project" comprising of the world's brightest scientists to find an alternative energy source, but BIG OIL and BIG WOOD (Weyerhauser and Georgia Pacific) have their tentacles wrapped around the politician's throat, and we are all too preoccupied with cellphones, video games, RHP, X-boxes...you name it...the clash of civilizations going on right now isn't helping either.
There is a window for action. We could vote for green political representatives, but people don't. Not on either side of the Atlantic. The reason being that it would be considered by most to be a wasted vote! Wasted chance more like..... so how did you vote? Feel free just to say 'not green' if youre embarassed about voting Republican.
Originally posted by chancremechanicIt's a question of priorities, I hear you on the issue of the economy, I really do..... but it has been drummed into us that another 30's style depression is the worst outcome globally, for eveybody. Would you concede though, that it is global warming that is most likely to destabilise the economy and cause this? Further the effects will be more fundamental than just economic.
Look, I hate Republicans and Democrats; I hate politicians period! Whether they are on the left side of the Atlantic or right side, they all suck balls! I'm not familiar with the Greens, but if they can save the planet without sending the world into a Depression, or if they can prevent the American economy from going to hell in a handbasket, I'm al ...[text shortened]... oxes...you name it...the clash of civilizations going on right now isn't helping either.
As an economist my long-run cost-benefit analysis tells me depression of any kind is preferable to the fundamental economic insability that global warming will probably affect. Assuming I wil be as affected as everybody else, this is a good personal incentive to vote green, however I would apply the same logic to anybody questioning environmental economics.
Originally posted by TomPOk, I'm with you....I don't mind living in a shoebox as long as I have an acre of land to grow my food and raise some animals. I really hate the idea of HAVING to own a damn car! I really believe I can live like they did in the 1800s. Take away electricity, TVs, computers, etc...and you will have people committing suicide.....maybe we need this pandemic they're talking about, or a depression so the lazy will know what it means to work for a dime an hour. I've lived 45 years, have no children, am relatively healthy, so come what may.....bring it on......
It's a question of priorities, I hear you on the issue of the economy, I really do..... but it has been drummed into us that another 30's style depression is the worst outcome globally, for eveybody. Would you concede though, that it is global warming that is most likely to destabilise the economy and cause this? Further the effects will be more fundamental tha ...[text shortened]... te green, however I would apply the same logic to anybody questioning environmental economics.
Originally posted by TomPQ: Why did Vanutu drop the lawsuit against the US?
Hands up who believes in the potential threat......
A lot of americans on this site so this should be interesting!
An interesting case in point is the recent Baffin island Inuit lawsuit against the US state for damage to their environment and human rights by US carbon emissions. Sounds far fetched but it could be a landmark case if it goes to ...[text shortened]... ronment not higher on the global-political-economic agenda?!
All thoughts welcome.......
It was based on the premise that CO2 caused global warming, and global warming caused the sea level to rise. (Vanutu has a mean altitude of 28 feet)
A: Because the sea level isn't rising. In some places it's dropping.
Originally posted by c99uxWrong dude.
Q: Why did Vanutu drop the lawsuit against the US?
It was based on the premise that CO2 caused global warming, and global warming caused the sea level to rise. (Vanutu has a mean altitude of 28 feet)
A: Because the sea level isn't rising. In some places it's dropping.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_level_rise
computer modelling is still the most compelling evidence for global warming.
In order for them to work the ocean currents and the complex interplay between currents in transporting and dissapating heat is ignored and the 70% water mass is usually idealised as a static body of water, the topography of the planet is idealised at a constant height of a few feet and thousands of independant variables all affecting whether outcomes are reduced to a few significant ones
Originally posted by kmax87Is the point that we do not yet fully understand our planets weather and ecosystems? I am inclined to agree and urge everybody not to mess with it all so much.
computer modelling is still the most compelling evidence for global warming.
In order for them to work the ocean currents and the complex interplay between currents in transporting and dissapating heat is ignored and the 70% water mass is usually idealised as a static body of water, the topography of the planet is idealised at a constant height of a few fe ...[text shortened]... ds of independant variables all affecting whether outcomes are reduced to a few significant ones
'But Mr. President, if we reduce consumption of energy ,our GDP might drop, and then all the ethnic folks would be able to see on paper how poor they really are - we might come out of it with a per capita income like Russia! Russia, Mr. President, how would that look to the Europeans?!?'
Anybody remember George C Scott in Dr. Strangelove?
Originally posted by TomPAm all for global warming...
Hands up who believes in the potential threat......
A lot of americans on this site so this should be interesting!
An interesting case in point is the recent Baffin island Inuit lawsuit against the US state for damage to their environment and human rights by US carbon emissions. Sounds far fetched but it could be a landmark case if it goes to ...[text shortened]... ronment not higher on the global-political-economic agenda?!
All thoughts welcome.......
Who likes this crap cold weather anyway..?!
Originally posted by scottishinnzSame page dude:
Wrong dude.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_level_rise
The sum of components indicates an acceleration of only 0.2 (mm/yr)/century, with a range from –1.1 to +0.7 (mm/yr)/century, consistent with observational finding of no acceleration in sea level rise during the 20th century.
In the month of February where it is supposed to be the coldest month of the year here in Texas, in the north central area where we might expect freezing or near freezing weather. It was 78 degrees Fahrenheit. That is 46 degrees above freezing. Late spring early summer type weather. Very little rain this year. Many fires as a result. more irrigation is required. Lakes are drying up. Land that was once very fertile becoming desert. The young might not notice because it is a slow process. But in my 47 years I see a big difference. I have seen a lot of winters. I used to throw snow balls yearly. I haven't seen one in several years. Not this year. I don't even own a coat any more. I don't need one. While it may feel good now it will be blistering this summer. Global warming is alive and well. And it's not a good thing. And Humans are supposed to be intelligent. Pigs have better brains. They don't destroy the world as we do.