Originally posted by crythiasProliferation of guns generally equals proliferation of the use of guns.
The law abiding populace should be able to defend themselves legally with guns.
The criminals will arm themselves anyway.
Some people think that the criminals will only arm themselves because the law-abiding populace does. I disagree. The thief is generally going to be one up on his victim. The victim then ups his security standards in response.
A ...[text shortened]... dvancement of security goes both passive and active. And one of those active ways is weaponry.
If there's a lot of them around then a lot of accidents will occur, a lot more will fall into the wrong hands, a lot will be used in situations that otherwise would not have escalated to the use of lethal force stage.
There is no argument that having more guns is a better situation for a country. It obviously isn't.
You are worried that criminals will get them anyway. Maybe a lot would not make the effort if it were not required to get the job done.
Canada is a strange one. Lots of guns with very low use of lethal force.
But wait a minute... there is only 1 Canadian per square kilometre in most of Canada. Perhaps their guns just don't have the range for them to bother taking a pop at anyone. 😵
I guess we should get rid of cars because of the number of deaths they cause.
Misuse of guns is not a good reason to ban them. Govenments should not limit any freedoms simply because some people abuse them. Or we'd have to get ride of cars and make eveyone take buses. Better yet, trains with soft sides and foam-rubber seats.
I do like to $10,000 bullets method. 😀
Originally posted by crythiasits a catch 22 situation, I buy a gun to protect my home, you buy a rifle, I buy a shothun you buy (or steal) a AK-47, whats next a tank? I lived in SA most of my life, I had guns around me all the time, I have been shot at twice (by people I know, they thought the guns were empty) my brother has been shot in the face by my other brother and nearly died, only luck and quick thinking saved him. the only use for a gun is to kill another human being. As the old saying goes dont bring a knife to a gun fight, and that is the state of the world today. Watch bowling for columbine it say's alot that I can't.
The law abiding populace should be able to defend themselves legally with guns.
The criminals will arm themselves anyway.
Some people think that the criminals will only arm themselves because the law-abiding populace does. I disagree. The thief is generally going to be one up on his victim. The victim then ups his security standards in response.
A ...[text shortened]... dvancement of security goes both passive and active. And one of those active ways is weaponry.
Originally posted by ColettiThis argument only holds water with respect to rifles, shotguns, etc., since there are legitimate uses for these types of guns (eg. hunting). There is no need to allow private citizens to own handguns, automatic weapons, etc.
I guess we should get rid of cars because of the number of deaths they cause.
Misuse of guns is not a good reason to ban them. Govenments should not limit any freedoms simply because some people abuse them. Or we'd have to get ride of cars and make eveyone take buses. Better yet, trains with soft sides and foam-rubber seats.
I do like to $10,000 bullets method. 😀
I believe this is why the gun death rate in Canada is small, despite the large number of guns per capita. The vast majority of guns here are hunting rifles. Sure you could kill a person with a hunting rifle, but it's not like having a handgun in your pocket, just waiting for someone to try to rob you.
What's interesting about such sites as http://www.guncontrol.ca/Content/Cda-US.htm is that, if you discount suicide, the firearms accidental deaths are statistically close (0.2 deaths per 100K, or 2 out of 1 Million (Canada), versus 0.3 deaths per 100K, or 3 out of 1 Million (US)). And this is old data, 1998.
True, better odds than lottery, but [sarcasm]*sniff, If there is even one more life per million, it's too many!*[/sarcasm] Ohhh Kay. It's like SARS. Except SARS is one in 10: 8,098 people worldwide became sick with SARS during the 2003 outbreak. Of these, 774 died. http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/sars/factsheet.htm
I'm not sure what to say about 6330% (63.3x) increase in hanguns only reflecting in a 1450% (14.5x) increase in murders by handguns. I'd be concerned if there was parity, but it's not parity.
Still, it comes down to enforcement of laws on the books, if you want to go there... keep criminals from having access to illegally imported guns.
Originally posted by richjohnsonWhat is the legitimate use of hang-gliding? Or better yet - bungee jumping. Shall we ban those too? Can you tell me the legitimate purpose of back yard trampolines? I bet more people per-capita are injured using those insane death traps than with handguns. (Hey, I watch those funny home video shows. You hardly see episode without someone doing something stupid on a trampoline. Notice how they cut the video before the broken bones and screams of pain are obvious to the viewer. And they don't show the ones where there's to much blood to edit out. 😉 )
This argument only holds water with respect to rifles, shotguns, etc., since there are legitimate uses for these types of guns (eg. hunting). There is no need to allow private citizens to own handguns, automatic weapons, etc.
I believe this is why the gun death rate in Canada is small, despite the large number of guns per capita. The vast majority o ...[text shortened]... but it's not like having a handgun in your pocket, just waiting for someone to try to rob you.
Handguns, assault rifles, etc. all have a very legitimate use - to kill people. That's the whole point of owning one, to shoot bad guys. 🙂 That doesn't just hold water - it's water tight. 😀
Originally posted by Coletti
What is the legitimate use of hang-gliding? Or better yet - bungee jumping. Shall we ban those too? Can you tell me the legitimate purpose of back yard trampolines? I bet more people per-capita are injured using those insane death traps than with handguns.
Are people who choose not to go hang-gliding ever injured by a hang-glider?
(Hey, I watch those funny home video shows. You hardly see episode without someone doing something stupid on a trampoline. Notice how they cut the video before the broken bones and screams of pain are obvious to the viewer. And they don't show the ones where there's to much blood to edit out. 😉 )
Not on most television stations, but some of the extreme sports injury shows are brutal.
😲
Handguns, assault rifles, etc. all have a very legitimate use - to kill people. That's the whole point of owning one, to shoot bad guys. 🙂 That doesn't just hold water - it's water tight. 😀
Agreed. This is why the police and military have such weapons. I suppose there's an occasional vigilante out there who goes around killing bad guys, but the only examples I can think of are fictional. Besides, every ficticious vigilante I can think of would have no problem finding a multi-barreled assault weapon and enough ammo to last for days. So that pretty much leaves just gun enthusiasts and criminals.
Which is worse: preventing law-abiding gun enthusiasts from having state-of-the-art arsenals, or allowing criminals (or potential criminals) to purchase these things at their local sporting goods retailer (after filling out the proper forms of course)?
What is the difference between a AK-47 and the firing mechanism of lets say a Remington 30-06 semi auto. Other than cosmetics on the AK-47 both use the same priciples of a semi-automatic or even an automatic weapon. When the bullet ignites, it forces the bolt back and ejects the spent cardridge. Then the bolt is forced forward by the buffer spring thus, inserting a new round in the chamber as the bolt is pushed forward over the magazine. Other than magazine capacity there is no difference other than the muzzle velocity.
Guns or cars? 🙂 I saw it mentioned, so I thought I'd just pass this info along:
2001 Motor Vehicle overall deaths: 43,987 285,317,572 or 15.42 per 100K (all MV)
According to http://www.phrasebase.com/countries/United%20States.html, there are 798 cars per 1000 people. (Most per capita) and Yay! tied with China for most metric tons CO2 emmissions 🙂
2001 Firearm deaths 29,573 285,317,572 10.36 per 100K
other source is the CDC link given above.
Gun control as an issue is slight compared to Motor vehicle deaths. Better things to think about anyway.
Originally posted by crythiasGot to ask - will the new Iraq constitution framed with American help give all Iraqi citizens the right to bear arms? An essential part of freedom is to have an AK-47 - and so handy when one of those tin-plated Humvees venture down your street!
The law abiding populace should be able to defend themselves legally with guns.
The criminals will arm themselves anyway.
Some people think that the criminals will only arm themselves because the law-abiding populace does. I disagree. The thief is generally going to be one up on his victim. The victim then ups his security standards in response.
A ...[text shortened]... dvancement of security goes both passive and active. And one of those active ways is weaponry.
My 2 cents,
I wonder if there any statistics which would show the ratio of gun crimes in the US, taking into account that in several of the largest cities, New York, Chicago, Wash DC, etc., it is very difficult for an honest, law abiding citizen to posses a hand gun? I know in the state in which I live, a "right to carry" law was passed nearly 10 years ago, thus allowing anyone who passed a background check (no previous felonies, mental problems, etc) the right to carry a conceled weapon on their person.
In those 10 years, not a single crime using a handgun by a permit holder was reported, while there have been dozens a stories where a permit holder prevented a crime (and NOT by shooting anyone). The most vivid that comes to mind was a child obduction that was stopped near a local shopping mall.
It might be interesting to see.....
Odie
Originally posted by bbarrOn some pistols you are correct. My 45 colt is much more accurate when I hold it with both hands. It has a lot of recoil and in fact I'm going to the range today and shoot up some Ossama targets.😵
I always heard that gun control is holding it with both hands. 😉