16 Oct 23
@metal-brain saidIrans main goal you mean and the genocidal scum of Hamas are more than happy to sacrifice Gaza’s babies to obtain that goal, it’s all about Iranian geopolitical goals
@Mott-The-Hoople
Hamas ended that deal. Perhaps that was Hamas' main goal.
The timing is suspect. It worked too. Now SA will not touch it with a ten foot pole.
16 Oct 23
@kevcvs57 saidIf not wanting civilians to leave the country equates to using human shields then Ukraine was using human shields. Zelensky knew Russia was going to invade, but told the people Russia was unlikely to. That was to keep people from leaving the country instead of escaping the war.
Irans main goal you mean and the genocidal scum of Hamas are more than happy to sacrifice Gaza’s babies to obtain that goal, it’s all about Iranian geopolitical goals
Human shields in Ukraine, right?
@metal-brain saidI’m talking about the original Hamas attack on civilians, the sole purpose of which was to get this Israeli reaction and scupper the Israeli / Saudi detente which would normalise relations between the two states and form a bulwark against Iran and its proxies in the region.
If not wanting civilians to leave the country equates to using human shields then Ukraine was using human shields. Zelensky knew Russia was going to invade, but told the people Russia was unlikely to. That was to keep people from leaving the country instead of escaping the war.
Human shields in Ukraine, right?
But yeah I’d rather be in a refugee camp run by the UN in northern Sinai than a death camp run by Hamas in southern Gaza but Hamas will never let their human shields leave, every dead Gazan baby or mother is a bonus ball for the ayatollahs in Tehran.
16 Oct 23
@kevcvs57 saidYou parrot neo-conservative talking points endlessly with little actual support for such wild claims. How about this:
I’m talking about the original Hamas attack on civilians, the sole purpose of which was to get this Israeli reaction and scupper the Israeli / Saudi detente which would normalise relations between the two states and form a bulwark against Iran and its proxies in the region.
But yeah I’d rather be in a refugee camp run by the UN in northern Sinai than a death camp run by Ham ...[text shortened]... r human shields leave, every dead Gazan baby or mother is a bonus ball for the ayatollahs in Tehran.
"
The United States has collected specific intelligence that suggests senior Iranian government officials were caught by surprise by Saturday’s bloody attack on Israel by Hamas, according to multiple sources familiar with the intelligence.
The existence of the intelligence has cast doubt on the idea that Iran was directly involved in the planning, resourcing or approving of the operation, sources said."
https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/11/politics/us-intelligence-iran-hamas-doubt/index.html
It seems more credible that Hamas was reacting to developments inside the occupied territories than basing their decisions on global geopolitical musings.
16 Oct 23
@kevcvs57 saidOr this:
I’m talking about the original Hamas attack on civilians, the sole purpose of which was to get this Israeli reaction and scupper the Israeli / Saudi detente which would normalise relations between the two states and form a bulwark against Iran and its proxies in the region.
But yeah I’d rather be in a refugee camp run by the UN in northern Sinai than a death camp run by Ham ...[text shortened]... r human shields leave, every dead Gazan baby or mother is a bonus ball for the ayatollahs in Tehran.
""We have no evidence, no proof, no intelligence proof of Iranian involvement in this situation," IDF Major Niv Dinar said in response to Newsweek's question during a virtual press briefing Tuesday."
https://www.newsweek.com/israel-has-no-proof-irans-involvement-hamas-attacks-idf-says-1833541
16 Oct 23
@no1marauder saidApparent lack of Iranian involvement (or even that they're covering up and denying whatever involvement they did have) is a tremendous source of relief for me.
Or this:
""We have no evidence, no proof, no intelligence proof of Iranian involvement in this situation," IDF Major Niv Dinar said in response to Newsweek's question during a virtual press briefing Tuesday."
https://www.newsweek.com/israel-has-no-proof-irans-involvement-hamas-attacks-idf-says-1833541
It bodes well for keeping the Hezbollah front quiet.
16 Oct 23
1 edit
@sh76 saidI imagine it would be if it means Israel can conduct a massive ground offensive into Gaza which will result in tens of thousands of deaths without the bother of any reaction by Hezbollah's (admittedly meager compared to Israel's) miliary wing.
Apparent lack of Iranian involvement (or even that they're covering up and denying whatever involvement they did have) is a tremendous source of relief for me.
It bodes well for keeping the Hezbollah front quiet.
I'm not so sure they will stand idly by if and when that happens, however.
16 Oct 23
@no1marauder saidI'm not in favor of "a massive ground offensive into Gaza which will result in tens of thousands of deaths."
I imagine it would be if it means Israel can conduct a massive ground offensive into Gaza which will result in tens of thousands of deaths without the bother of any reaction by Hezbollah's (admittedly meager compared to Israel's) miliary wing.
I'm not so sure they will stand idly by if and when that happens, however.
The only thing I'm in favor of is whatever is necessary and most likely to keep people alive and safe.
16 Oct 23
@sh76 saidAnd what, exactly, would that be at this juncture?
I'm not in favor of "a massive ground offensive into Gaza which will result in tens of thousands of deaths."
The only thing I'm in favor of is whatever is necessary and most likely to keep people alive and safe.
I'll be candid and say "I don't know".
16 Oct 23
@no1marauder saidNeither do I
And what, exactly, would that be at this juncture?
I'll be candid and say "I don't know".
17 Oct 23
2 edits
Where exactly did Hamas attack? What part of Israel are we talking about here?
It’s worth pointing out that if there were no Jews in the Philistine territories Hamas would not be able to kill Israeli Jews. Gaza is too far from the provinces of Judah and Israel to behead people on those places.
wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_ancient_Israel_and_Judah#/media/File%3AKingdoms_of_Israel_and_Judah_map_830.svg