28 May 10
Originally posted by FabianFnasMaybe if you say it 4 times in one post, that will make it true. At only 3 times, you're being too ambiguous.
Israel is a criminal nation.
Currently Israel is blocking aid from abroad so it cannot reach Gaza.
The Gaza people is suffering and human nations cannot even help them.
Israel is a criminal nation.
If Israel want stable peace, then they shoud start to act humanely.
Until then - Israel is a criminal nation.
28 May 10
3 edits
Originally posted by adam warlock🙂
What started operation Cast Lead?
Ps: It's that time of the month again. 😛
Yes.
To be honest, I'm not sure why I even do this.
It's ironic. When I'm dealing with my friends and family members, I'm the dove. I'm the guy arguing for the Palestinian state and ripping the idea of the settlements, etc.
But here, the opposition to everything Israel seems so overwhelming so often, I can't help but ride to Israel's defense.
The cycle generally goes something like:
1) Something about Israel comes up; either me defending it or any one of 10 or 12 others lambasting it. I may be wrong, but I can't recall anyone else starting a thread to defend Israel.
2) I come to Israel's defense.
3) Somewhere between 5 and 10 people attack my comment. Roughly 1/3 of them will address my point, 1/3 of them will ignore my point and go after Israel on general principles and the last 1/3 will call into question my sanity, education, morality, fitness to discuss matters in the debates forum or sexual orientation.
3) Whodey or Zeeblebot will defend my position with a general sardonic comment that more attacks the general double standard of the American or European left than it does really address the issue; but is welcome nonetheless.
4) ATY and Generalissimo will chime in to hedge their bet with a neutral comment or a comment that softly supports one side or the other. Kmax may also help the Israeli cause at times, but only if the most clever comment he can think of happens to be one that supports Israel.
5) The argument, which is basically me against 5 or 6 others, will rage for a few days.
6) The argument will slowly die as I become emotionally exhausted discussing the matter and take a personal vow to stop discussing Israel on the forum to ensure that my BP* stays down.
7) Everything will stay quiet on the Israel front for a few weeks
8) Rinse, lather, repeat.
* - No, not that BP! THAT BP will have no trouble staying down, I assure you.
28 May 10
Originally posted by sh76War is also justified when someone steals your land and represses you.
Strawman.
When did I ever say that blockading Gaza is not an act of war?
Of course it's an act of war. War is justified when the other guy shoots first.
Edit: The blockade of Tiran was (along with other hostile acts) a justification for the attack on Egypt; not any other country.
The Israeli blockade of Gaza was not initially in response to any armed act, but to Hamas coming to power. Is it an "act of war" for the Palestinians to have a "government" that Israel doesn't like?
28 May 10
Originally posted by sh76It's no wonder why your arguments are so weak and lacking in factual support; you don't even believe them.
🙂
Yes.
To be honest, I'm not sure why I even do this.
It's ironic. When I'm dealing with my friends and family members, I'm the dove. I'm the guy arguing for the Palestinian state and ripping the idea of the settlements, etc.
But here, the opposition to everything Israel seems so overwhelming so often, I can't help but ride to Israel's defense.
...[text shortened]...
* - No, not that BP! THAT BP will have no trouble staying down, I assure you.
28 May 10
Originally posted by no1marauderIt's an act of war to have a government who openly and proudly launches terrorist attacks against you under a proudly and openly stated mission to destroy you.
War is also justified when someone steals your land and represses you.
The Israeli blockade of Gaza was not initially in response to any armed act, but to Hamas coming to power. Is it an "act of war" for the Palestinians to have a "government" that Israel doesn't like?
28 May 10
Originally posted by sh76Category true.
category 3
sh76: When I'm dealing with my friends and family members, I'm the dove. I'm the guy arguing for the Palestinian state and ripping the idea of the settlements, etc.
But here, the opposition to everything Israel seems so overwhelming so often, I can't help but ride to Israel's defense.
So you don't even believe your pathetic arguments here. That's a relief; the last thing we need is another whodey.
28 May 10
Originally posted by sh76In other words, it's an "act of war" for Palestinians to resist occupation. Maybe so, but the occupation, not the Palestinian resistance to it, is a violation of IL. The Palestinians are justified to fight Israel so long as Israel occupies and oppresses them, but Israel is not justified to occupy and repress them. So Israel is guilty of Crimes against Peace, War Crimes and Crimes against Humanity.
It's an act of war to have a government who openly and proudly launches terrorist attacks against you under a proudly and openly stated mission to destroy you.
28 May 10
Originally posted by no1marauderYou're missing the point.
Category true.
sh76: When I'm dealing with my friends and family members, I'm the dove. I'm the guy arguing for the Palestinian state and ripping the idea of the settlements, etc.
But here, the opposition to everything Israel seems so overwhelming so often, I can't help but ride to Israel's defense.
So you don't even be ...[text shortened]... your pathetic arguments here. That's a relief; the last thing we need is another whodey.
I AM in favor of a Palestinian state and I am (in general) against the settlements, here and elsewhere.
What I am NOT for is denying Israel the right to defend itself and the "international community" holding Israel to the ridiculous double standard that it does.
There is no inconsistency between arguing in favor of a peaceful Palestinian state to those who oppose it and arguing in favor of Israel being allowed to defend itself to those who oppose that.
My "pathetic" arguments are more than capable of making mincemeat of your hateful diatribes.
28 May 10
1 edit
Originally posted by sh76This sounds like a Graucho Marxism....You have the right to remain silent, but you may give up that right at any time by saying something funny....^^ ---...
Kmax may also help the Israeli cause at times, but only if the most clever comment he can think of happens to be one that supports Israel.
29 May 10
Originally posted by sh76You do it because you love to stir up the pot. I know it because I do it too.
🙂
Yes.
To be honest, I'm not sure why I even do this.
It's ironic. When I'm dealing with my friends and family members, I'm the dove. I'm the guy arguing for the Palestinian state and ripping the idea of the settlements, etc.
But here, the opposition to everything Israel seems so overwhelming so often, I can't help but ride to Israel's defense.
...[text shortened]...
* - No, not that BP! THAT BP will have no trouble staying down, I assure you.
In what category do you place me in your point 3?
It's an act of war to have a government who openly and proudly launches terrorist attacks against you under a proudly and openly stated mission to destroy you.
Now, now; you know that not to be exactly true.
What I am NOT for is denying Israel the right to defend itself and the "international community" holding Israel to the ridiculous double standard that it does.
What about Palestine right to defend itself? What about Palestinian rights to self-determination? What double standards are you talking about? Israel gets fair game in almost everything that they do (and when the word gets out it's little more than harsh words. For a lot less a lot of countries were invaded and/or got ral sanctions imposed on them), and their most grave offenses to human rights are barely reported.
There is no inconsistency between arguing in favor of a peaceful Palestinian state to those who oppose it and arguing in favor of Israel being allowed to defend itself to those who oppose that.
Who opposes the right of Israel to defend itself. I never saw this position being defended here (truth be told that I'm not in the debate forum for a long time) and I don't know of anybody who thinks like that.
On the other hand there's a lot of Israeli politicians that seem to think that Palestinians have no right defending themselves. There seems to be a lot of Israel politicians that think that whenever Palestinians defend themselves they are committing some kind of grave sin that must be swiftly dealt with.