13 Jan 05
Originally posted by KneverKnightI would define evil as selfishness, it can wrap itself in many disguises
What is the nature of evil? Does it include natural disasters such as the tsunami recently inflicted upon South Asia, or is it's definition more narrow, confined to the brains and deeds of Man? Or is it more than those choices, or something else again?
but the core will always be how it benefits itself. Pride, greed, and
on and on are the cord of evil, again in my opinion.
Kelly
13 Jan 05
Originally posted by KneverKnightEvil is a comparative perspective of good.
What is the nature of evil? Does it include natural disasters such as the tsunami recently inflicted upon South Asia, or is it's definition more narrow, confined to the brains and deeds of Man? Or is it more than those choices, or something else again?
Good is a comparative perspective of evil.
Two sides of the same coin, so to speak.
13 Jan 05
Originally posted by caissad4I disagree with this, because I do not believe that evil is necessary
Evil is a comparative perspective of good.
Good is a comparative perspective of evil.
Two sides of the same coin, so to speak.
at all, it is real and will be dealt with. Good does not need evil to
exist, while evil is a deviation of the way things should be. To say
evil is the flip side of good, which basically says they are equal in
stature, when in fact evil is a poor substitute for good.
Kelly
13 Jan 05
Originally posted by KellyJayI disagree, if there was no evil one would have no concept of good, one would only understand 'the way things should be' which in turn would be called 'the way things are'. The mere fact that we have a term for evil and good shows that they exist and are mutually joined. Take the idea of evil as an opposite away and you have to ask the question 'what is good?'. Since you have an idea of what good is, is it so hard to say evil is the opposite of that?
I disagree with this, because I do not believe that evil is necessary
at all, it is real and will be dealt with. Good does not need evil to
exist, while evil is a deviation of the way things should be. To say
evil is the flip side of good, which basically says they are equal in
stature, when in fact evil is a poor substitute for good.
Kelly
You claim they are not equal in stature, but as a christian surely you believe that satan has actually had an undeniable impact on our lives than, perhaps more so to some than god? Resisting temptation and the perversions of the modern world indicates to me that for someone who believes, the statures of good and evil are very much equal and intertwined. It is a battle for believers and one which is hard won, the two sides are well matched I think.
13 Jan 05
2 edits
Originally posted by StarrmanThey are joined only because evil is a matter of not doing what
I disagree, if there was no evil one would have no concept of good, one would only understand 'the way things should be' which in turn would be called 'the way things are'. The mere fact that we have a term for evil and good shows tha ...[text shortened]... nd one which is hard won, the two sides are well matched I think.
is right, or good. Evil does not stand alone, while good does. One
can be quite content and never know evil as well. Good can be and
is a blessing all by itself.
Kelly
13 Jan 05
Originally posted by KellyJayWe're edging towards a normative state discussion, but I think what you are calling good is just the absence of evil. That doesn't mean that it is a positive situation. I think there is a difference from a state absent of evil and a state of goodness. Consequently good is a positive over and above a natural absence of evil. This in point would suggest that evil is a negative over and above the absence of good.
They are joined only because evil is a matter of not doing what
is right, or good. Evil does not stand alone, while good does. One
can be quite content and never know evil as well. Good can be and
is a blessing all by itself.
Kelly
13 Jan 05
2 edits
Originally posted by StarrmanI believe evil's core is selfishness, the more evil the more self
We're edging towards a normative state discussion, but I think what you are calling good is just the absence of evil. That doesn't mean that it is a positive situation. I think there is a difference from a state absent of evil and a sta ...[text shortened]... uggest that evil is a negative over and above the absence of good.
centered. A good universe does not require evil, balance is
taking care of everything according to needs. While evil basically
is a brake from that, it puffs up, it steals, takes, withholds that
which is owed, and so on. It puts its own desires over all else,
it has no regard for authority, for positions of honor, indeed the
only thing it cares about is itself.
Kelly
13 Jan 05
Originally posted by KellyJayOkay, I can agree with most that, but I think it is important to note that whilst a good universe does not require evil, we do not live in a good universe. Nor in fact do I believe you can associate attributes like good or evil to a universe. It is people that are good or evil, not the rest of existance, we have an awareness of our actions and it is up to us to decide how to act upon them. It is purely a human trait and as the potential for evil is part of everyone as much as the potential for good is, I have to stay with the idea that they are opposite sides of the same coin.
I believe evil's core is selfishness, the more evil the more self
centered. A good universe does not require evil, balance is
taking care of everything according to needs. While evil basically
is a brake from that, it puffs up, it steals, takes, withholds that
which is owed, and so on. It puts its own desires over all else,
it has no regard for authority, for positions of honor, indeed the
only thing it cares about is itself.
Kelly
13 Jan 05
2 edits
Originally posted by StarrmanI agree evil is basically something limited to living beings with both
Okay, I can agree with most that, but I think it is important to note that whilst a good universe does not require evil, we do not live in a good universe. Nor in fact do I believe you can associate attributes like good or evil to a unive ...[text shortened]... stay with the idea that they are opposite sides of the same coin.
understanding, and choice. So a rock, a storm, a dog do not have
the ability to be evil, while at the same time they do require some
sort of respect. Since I believe there are more beings *spiritual*
in our universe I believe more than humans have to the ability to
be evil.
I still disagree with your suggestion that simply because people can
do both good and evil actions that makes it the same coin.
Kelly
13 Jan 05
Originally posted by KellyJayFair enough, I was limiting it to known existence, but if aliens for example did appear, there's no reason they wouldn't have the same moral dilemas. Spiritual beings aren't something I can extend my arguement to, but for these purposes I suppose there's not much difference between them and aliens, so yes there is a potential for other entities to express good and evil.
I agree evil is basically something limited to living beings with both
understanding, and choice. So a rock, a storm, a dog do not have
the ability to be evil, while at the same time they do require some
sort of respect. Since I believe there are more beings *spiritual*
in our universe I believe more than humans have to the ability to
be evil.
Kelly
14 Jan 05
Originally posted by KellyJayThe universe does not require evil or good, it just is. Good and evil are human conceptions and they are based on the feeling of being an individual. You are right in that: evil takes from the individual, the human. Nothing can ever be taken away from the universe, so of course evil means nothing to the universe. Because of this conncetion between individuality and evil, your concept that evil can be eradicated is almost rediculous.
I believe evil's core is selfishness, the more evil the more self
centered. A good universe does not require evil, balance is
taking care of everything according to needs. While evil basically
is a brake from that, it puffs up, it steals, takes, withholds that
which is owed, and so on. It puts its own desires over all else,
it has no regard for authority, for positions of honor, indeed the
only thing it cares about is itself.
Kelly
I say almost, because for it to be completely rediculous or actually fathomable requires more information. If your concept of the eradication of evil allows us to say as individual humans, then it is rediculous. In death, however, we can defeat evil, for then we would no longer be human, no longer be individual (that is if you believe in an afterlife). We would be "one with God" or however you want to put it. No more human, no more evil.
Not that I'm saying that you can't try to eliminate evil as a human. First, you would have to work on yourself. Evil is connected to possessions, or the idea of possession, so you would have to get rid of anything that could be concidered an asset: money, house, friends, family, computer (no way!) et cetera. What happens after that I can't help you with, for my imagination can't wrap itself around such a state.
Good luck in your quest.
... --- ...
15 Jan 05
...evil is something that man creates thru his free will...only man can
create or continue evil.
....sin is seperate from evil...
....sin is the distance from god...the farther one moves from god the
more sin...
....lucifer sinned by moving away from the light...he lives in darkness
and thus not in the light he lives in sin...
....we should turn away from bad or evil action...
....we should try to live closer to the light and thus in less sin....
15 Jan 05
Originally posted by GENGARI agree with your concept of sin, though it is a touch off topic. You should have participated in my thread on the definition of sin. I don't exactly share your view of Lucifer, but since that is not the content of this thread, I will simply thank you for sharing your thoughts.
...evil is something that man creates thru his free will...only man can
create or continue evil.
....sin is seperate from evil...
....sin is the distance from god...the farther one moves from god the
more sin...
....lucifer sinned by moving away from the light...he lives in darkness
and thus not in the light he lives in sin...
....we should turn away f ...[text shortened]... bad or evil action...
....we should try to live closer to the light and thus in less sin....