Originally posted by kirksey957I think Jimmy the Greek said that black folk are better athletes because of all the time their anscestors spent picking cotton. Dusty Baker said the black folk are better able to handle the heat because of the pigmentation of their skin. Do you not see the difference?
I thought they said essentially the same thing. Basically that their breeding made them better at what they were doing either by being a better athlete or tolerating the heat better. Correct me if I'm wrong. Kirk
For me the offensiveness of something depends greatly on the circumstances, for example I am much more likely to be offended if a) the comments refer to me personally, and/or b) the author is someone I know. For example, if I received an e-mail entitled "Mathematics is devil-worship!", and upon reading it, decided that it was written in earnest, I would assume it was spam from some unknown lunatic. If it turned out to be from someone I knew I would take it more seriously.
I think there is a case for censorship of personal correspondence, where both parties know each other, to combat bullying and harassment, and also official correspondence, where the author is writing as, say, Vice-Chancellor of a university, as such organisations need some control over what their officials say 'on the record'.
But this is quite different to censorship in other contexts, such as the expression of political views, which I think is wrong, however much you dislike what is being said, as long as it isn't an incitement to break the law.
Originally posted by bbarrHow can you not find fault with what Dusty Baker said to the media?
I have no problem with Dusty Baker, but Jimmy the Greek has said things that nauseated me. Isn't Sisyphus currently coaching the Cubs...
Isn't that like having our cake and eating it too?
I have never cared for what Jimmy the Greek or Dusty Baker have said about minorities. But, I believe that everyone should be held to the same standard. Period.
Originally posted by willatkinsDid he say something different than what I posted I thought he said? If not, then the difference between the two statements should be clear. If you disagree, then please explain.
How can you not find fault with what Dusty Baker said to the media?
Isn't that like having our cake and eating it too?
I have never cared for what Jimmy the Greek or Dusty Baker have said about minorities. But, I believe that everyone should be held to the same standard. Period.
I think there is an underlying issue that we're trying to get to. Forget Jimmy the Greek and Dusty Baker for a moment. I think the issue is the double standards in society. Trent Lott talks about Strom Thurmond in glowing terms and thre is an outcry from black and white. Some rappers talk about "niggas and their stable of bitches" and it is perfectly acceptable. I guess I'm asking for some consistency. That's all. Kirk
Originally posted by kirksey957But perhaps in a society built upon racial and gender domination consistency is something you just can't have. Black kids call their buddies their 'niggas'. amongst the homosexual community here in Seattle the term 'fag' is (in many cases) one of endearment. I hear women in the pub where I tend bar call their friends 'bitch' or 'slut'. Of course, if a straight white man, under normal circumstances, used these terms to describe any of these other folk, offense would be taken. Those who would take offense to the use of these terms by straight white men are not being inconsistent. They are in the process of coming to terms with a leagacy of hatred, abuse, and discrimination. They have taken these terms and co-opted them, made them their own. The connotations these terms have are not invariant between contexts.
I think there is an underlying issue that we're trying to get to. Forget Jimmy the Greek and Dusty Baker for a moment. I think the issue is the double standards in society. Trent Lott talks about Strom Thurmond in glowing terms and thre is an outcry from black and white. Some rappers talk about "niggas and their stable of bitches" and it is perfectly acceptable. I guess I'm asking for some consistency. That's all. Kirk
Originally posted by kirksey957I don't think it's necessarily unreasonable to expect to be able to hold an elected official to a higher standard of decency than the average rap artist. Certainly the GOP had no qualms about implementing that sort of policy vis a vis Bill Clinton.
I think there is an underlying issue that we're trying to get to. Forget Jimmy the Greek and Dusty Baker for a moment. I think the issue is the double standards in society. Trent Lott talks about Strom Thurmond in glowing terms and thre is an outcry from black and white. Some rappers talk about "niggas and their stable of bitches" and it is perfectly acceptable. I guess I'm asking for some consistency. That's all. Kirk
A senator claims to be representing the interests of the state and his constituents - a rapper only represents his own interests.
-mike
The essay that I originally posted was given back to me today with the omments:
"Essay is difficult for reader to understand, not because I am simple, but because the ideas are too much for this assignment. More adherence to assignment and less intellectualizing is needed here [the instructor always knocks the passive voice, hypocritically apparently]. ...relax your diction to suit purpose/audience."
Well crikey. Thanks for the input, everyone. I enjoyed this discussion, even if some people didn't....
Originally posted by royalchickensnork! grin! grimmace! flinch!... mark... that all translates to "Only I, the grand poobaa of blather can speak in convolutions. Speak only in brief, concise sentences, just as I would, if I were at your plebian attainment." choke... You have a long career ahead... the secret is to spoof the bastard behind his back, and bend deeply in his esteemed presence. I'm not a cynic. But what am I?
The essay that I originally posted was given back to me today with the omments:
"Essay is difficult for reader to understand, not because I am simple, but because the ideas are too much for this assignment. More adherence to assignment and less intellectualizing is needed here [the instructor always knocks the passive voice, hypocritically apparent ...[text shortened]... nks for the input, everyone. I enjoyed this discussion, even if [b]some people didn't.... [/b]
Originally posted by royalchickenSounds like an unfortunate case of "I can't understand what he's talking about.... OK, I'll just nit pick for grammatical errors... uh-oh, can't find any. But I can't give an A to a paper I can't comprehend. I'll just give him a B..."
Actually, I laughed on getting it back; despite its apparent stylistic shortcomings, she said "Oh...no grammar errors." and gave me a B 🙂!
-mike