Originally posted by schakuhrYeah I dabled with the Albin (suprised you noticed!), with pretty good results. I think that might be the answer.
Maybe 3. ..e5!? with a likely tranposition to the Albin? (I thought you played that)
In any case, after 1. d4 d5 2. c4 Nc6, 3. Nf3 isn't really critical (in my opinion 3. cxd5 and 3. Nc3 are the most testing replies) so it shouldn't be too hard to implement this in your repertoire.
It's worth the trouble for finding a good response to all those pesky ...[text shortened]... is another way to equalize, as long as you follow it up with Bf5 or Bg4 before moving ..e6.
I have indded played 1.d4 d5 2.Nf3 Nc6 OTB with the intention of playing 3...e5 after 3.c4. Which he didn't (he played 3.e3).
However in my experience if people are going to play c4 they play it on move 2!
- Joined
- 16 Feb 07
- Moves
- 27653
I play the systems with g6 against the Colle (something like 1 d4 d5 2. Nf3 Nf6 3 3 e3 g6) - this leads to Catalan reversed, or Gruenfeld if white bails out and plays c4. This seems to be pretty comfortable for black. Definitely no kingside attack and black can slowly expand in the center.
Also, 1 d4 Nf6 2 Bg5 e6 is Ok and leads to positions with some play (eg. 3 e4 h6 and white often castled queenside with usual chances for both sides). I haven't tried it, but I think 2 Ne4 is OK too. Again, postions are at least somewhat unbalanced.
http://www.everymanchess.com/display.php?id=470
Your answer? It's out now in the UK, so you should get it and tell me how it is! I really liked Dembo's Grunfeld book, and almost exclusively played the Grunfeld and KID now, so it should at least be a trustworthy guide by someone who knows it's like to sit on the Black side of the Colle.
BTW - I completely hate these openings too. Kill 'Em All!
Originally posted by !~TONY~!Have seen this book yes!
http://www.everymanchess.com/display.php?id=470
Your answer? It's out now in the UK, so you should get it and tell me how it is! I really liked Dembo's Grunfeld book, and almost exclusively played the Grunfeld and KID now, so it should at least be a trustworthy guide by someone who knows it's like to sit on the Black side of the Colle.
BTW - I completely hate these openings too. Kill 'Em All!
Problem is I am not too keen on the Grunfeld/KID and all that fianchetto's on the K-side.
Reminds me of the Gallagher book brought out about 15 yrs ago called Beating the Anti Kings-Indians.
Originally posted by najdorfslayer1.d4 Nc6!?
Anyone else find these openings a pain in the arse to play against
1.d4
London System
Colle
Veresov
Trompowsky
Torre
I play 1...d5 against 1.d4 and my club collegues say that after 1...d5 Black is in for a dull game.
What do other people play as Black against these awful systems.
This was sparked by a recent OTB game against a ECF 1 ...[text shortened]... nly to claw back to a drawn position to later win on time!!!
[b]I SAY BAN THE LOT OF EM!![/b]
- Joined
- 16 Feb 07
- Moves
- 27653
Originally posted by najdorfslayerYeah - that's a problem.
...
Problem is I am not too keen on the Grunfeld/KID and all that fianchetto's on the K-side.
...
The only other alternative in this case is the early c5 systems as one of the other posters pointed out (and I don't know what to play against the Colle system). Otherwise, you generally end up in the postion you described in your first post - sterile equality, but no way to make an impression on white.
Originally posted by hunterknoxDo you really think the Dutch avoids complications? I played it for almost twenty years and eventually gave it up because the positions I ended up with were so boring.
Dutch every time. Your 1. d4 system players are generally looking to avoid complications - why give them the pleasure?
I now play the Kings Indian - it almost always leads to double edged positions.
Originally posted by najdorfslayerOh, I didn't notice that you didn't play one of these systems already. There is Cox's book, but I remember hearing from a friend that this book wasn't that great overall.
Have seen this book yes!
Problem is I am not too keen on the Grunfeld/KID and all that fianchetto's on the K-side.
Reminds me of the Gallagher book brought out about 15 yrs ago called Beating the Anti Kings-Indians.
As Dr. Tarrasch pointed out in his classic The Game of Chess, after 1 d4 d5, Black can play 2...c5 against almost any second move by White other than 2 c4. For example, Black is doing fine after either 1 d4 d5 2 e3 c5 or 1 d4 d5 2 Nf3 c5. Of course, in these two cases Black has to be prepared to play the Black side of a Tarrasch Defense in the event of 3 c4.
Another simple idea that seems to lead to roughly equal chances after 1 d4 d5, is to play 2...Bf5 against virtually any second move by White other than 2 c4. (2..Bf5 is perhaps playable even after 2 c4, but you have to really know your stuff because there are some really complicated lines after 3 Qb3 that require Black to gambit a pawn or two.
BTW, 1 d4 d5 c4 Bf5 is sometimes called the Keres Defense and is also sometimes called the Baltic Defense.