Spirituality
03 Oct 08
05 Oct 08
Originally posted by PinkFloydMy aploigies. I did not realise your skin was so thin.
I know enough to know that Christian behaavior doesn't include calling others names just because we don't share the same beliefs. Name-calling is a rather immature way to debate, don't you think?🙂
So how about an answer to the question.
How many deathbed confessions that you know of have led to salvation?
05 Oct 08
Originally posted by KingDavid403Well lets not quibble about minor differences in terminology.
PinkFloyd is correct. We are saved by grace, threw faith. Not by works lest any man should boast.
But also faith without works is dead faith. Paul clearly stated both these. The thief on the cross and others clearly didn't have anytime to have works. They didn't have time to get baptized or anything. But they were still saved. By Grace. If th ...[text shortened]... lived longer on this earth they would have had works also, because they were truly born again.
James says clearly that faith (by which I take to mean a declaration of faith) without works is dead. Clearly then the road to salvation has 2 parts, faith and works.
There is a prevailing doctrine by many Christians (on this site as well) that works do not matter, and as long as you are 'bornagain' you are saved. What is your view of this?
05 Oct 08
Originally posted by Rajk999There is a prevailing doctrine by many Christians (on this site as well) that works do not matter, and as long as you are 'bornagain' you are saved. What is your view of this?
Well lets not quibble about minor differences in terminology.
James says clearly that faith (by which I take to mean a declaration of faith) without works is dead. Clearly then the road to salvation has 2 parts, faith and works.
There is a prevailing doctrine by many Christians (on this site as well) that works do not matter, and as long as you are 'bornagain' you are saved. What is your view of this?
If you are born again, you will have good works along with your faith in Christ.
Can I do enough good works to get to heaven?? No.
Can I earn my own way into heaven somehow?? No.
Do I have to do so many good works each day to get into heaven?? No.
Will I have a love for my fellow man and do good works for him, and to him, if I see him in need?? Oh yes. It's only natural for a true christian.
Faith, without love and good works, is really no faith at all.
Even the demons believe in God and shutter at the thought.
05 Oct 08
Originally posted by Rajk999I know what's going to happen after I die.
So deathbed confessions prove that salvation is by grace ?
You mean you know what happened to the people after they died ?
You are crazier than I originally thought.
Why is it so crazy to trust in Jesus?
Isn't the Lord trustworthy? It's my understanding that He is.
Jesus told me that if I believe in Him, I have eternal life.
I believe in Him. Now, tell me why I shouldn't trust that I have eternal life?
05 Oct 08
Originally posted by epiphinehasIts impossible to get a straight answer from you guys.
I know what's going to happen after I die.
Why is it so crazy to trust in Jesus?
Isn't the Lord trustworthy? It's my understanding that He is.
Jesus told me that if I believe in Him, I have eternal life.
I believe in Him. Now, tell me why I shouldn't trust that I have eternal life?
But I will be patient. Here is the question again :
How many deathbed confessions that you know of have led to salvation?
05 Oct 08
Originally posted by KingDavid403So do you think its correct for pastors and leaders of congregations to tell church members that when they are baptised they are saved ?
[b]There is a prevailing doctrine by many Christians (on this site as well) that works do not matter, and as long as you are 'bornagain' you are saved. What is your view of this?
If you are born again, you will have good works along with your faith in Christ.
Can I do enough good works to get to heaven?? No.
Can I earn my own way into h ...[text shortened]... rks, is really no faith at all.
Even the demons believe in God and shutter at the thought.[/b]
05 Oct 08
2 edits
Originally posted by Rajk999Yes. They are saved. Jesus has promised us this, And they will stay saved as long as they stay with the Lord and try to obey His will on earth. Which is showing His love to all. Not just to whom we love, but to all. It's God's love that leads us to repentance.
So do you think its correct for pastors and leaders of congregations to tell church members that when they are baptised they are saved ?
If you're asking me if I believe in once saved always saved? I would say no. You can fall away out of God's grace. But you also always can return and God will forgive you if you truly mean it. As with the case of King David.
Judas would be a good example of one who fell away. Judas knew Jesus was God. He spent a couple years with Jesus. Jesus gave Judas and the other disciples power to go around healing all the sick and to even raise the dead. Judas knew were only that power comes from which is God.
On my studies of Judas I and others find a few different reasons for his downfall. Not just that he was also a thief and very greedy for money. But that's another story.
05 Oct 08
Originally posted by FabianFnasI couldn't answer that. Only God can. He knows all. I can tell you of two death bed conversions that I know of, The thief on the cross, And my own. The two are actually very similar. Except God has kept me alive on this earth for now.
Why not give us some statistics?
What is the percentage going up, and what is the percentage of going down.
And for comparisons: How much is these percentages changed when you're converted on the deathbed?
05 Oct 08
Originally posted by KingDavid403And we know nothing. So why speculate?
I couldn't answer that. Only God can. He knows all.
I'll believe in heaven when I get there. I believe in hell when I get there. I believe in god when he shows me some hard evidence of his existance.
Until then - heaven, hell and god is only a hypothesis, not even a good hypothesis.
05 Oct 08
Originally posted by KingDavid403You are saved IF, IF .... thats the point.
Yes. They are saved. Jesus has promised us this, And they will stay saved as long as they stay with the Lord and try to obey His will on earth. ...
You are not unconditionally saved.
Your salvation is not guaranteed.
You are saved IF .... and you know what the IF is.
So why do masses of Christians believe that they are saved and works is not essential and they cannot lose their salvation ?
Clearly you understand something that they dont.
05 Oct 08
1 edit
Originally posted by Rajk999Two--including the thief on the cross. But none of us can "know"--only God -- if a person truly repents. But I believe far many, many sinners find Chtist near or at the end of theeir lives. The parable of the workers who came to work at vatious times during the day but were all rewarded with the same pay indicates to this to me. I gather you perceive this to be a much rarer event.
My aploigies. I did not realise your skin was so thin.
So how about an answer to the question.
How many deathbed confessions that you know of have led to salvation?
