11 Dec 20
@divegeester saidOf course. Pauls doctrine pertaining to eternal life in the Kingdom of God [according to the church, and Christians in general], goes like this.
Are you being sincere in your assertion here?
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. (Ephesians 2:8-9 KJV)
This doctrine of Paul is used by Christians to conclude
- Nothing else is required as the sacrifice of Christ is complete
- works salvation [whatever that is], is unbiblical
- keeping the commandments is legalistic
Jesus said NONE of those things. Therefore, if this is Pauls doctrine then it is contradictory to the doctrine of Christ.
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11 Dec 20
@rajk999 saidBingo. So there we have it you are in fact the one saying Paul contradicts Christ. No one else.
Of course. Pauls doctrine pertaining to eternal life in the Kingdom of God [according to the church, and Christians in general], goes like this.
For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. (Ephesians 2:8-9 KJV)
This doctrine of Paul is used by Christians to conclude
- Nothin ...[text shortened]... ose things. Therefore, if this is Pauls doctrine then it is contradictory to the doctrine of Christ.
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@dj2becker saidJesus Says Not To Eat Meat Sacrificed to Idols, But Paul Says It Is Ok.
Bingo. So there we have it you are in fact the one saying Paul contradicts Christ. No one else.
• Jesus Says The Law Continues, But Paul Says No.
• Paul Says The Pharisees Followed The Law Rigorously, But Jesus Says They Were Lax About The Law.
• Jesus Says Salvation Initiates And Continues By Repentance From Sin and Obedience Besides Faith; Paul Says This is Heresy.
• Jesus Tells Apostles To Teach His Commands Given Prior to His Ascension While In The Flesh, But Paul Says Not To Do So.
• Paul Says Elders Are Entitled To Pay for 'Preaching & Teaching,' But Jesus Says No.
• Jesus Teaches There Are Only 12 Apostles Into Eternity, But Paul Adds Himself To The List As a Thirteenth.
• Paul Exhorts Celibacy, But Jesus Clearly Says It is A Choice Not Within Everyone's Power.
• Jesus Says There Is One Pastor and Teacher (Himself), But Paul Tells Church He is a Teacher, & There Are Many Pastors and Teachers.
• Paul Says God Is The God of the Dead, But Jesus Says God Is Not The God of the Dead.
• Paul Says God Does Not Live in Temples Made of Human Hands, But Jesus Says He Does.
• Jesus says Nations Of The World Are Under Satan, But Paul Says Its Rulers Are Agents of God.
• Jesus Teaches Rapture is Of Evil Ones First, But Paul Teaches The Opposite.
• Jesus Says A Call Is Revocable, But Paul Says It Is Irrevocable.
• Jesus Says Some Are Righteous, But Paul Says It Is Impossible.
• Paul Excludes Eating With Sinners But Christ's Example We Are To Follow, and the Lost Sheep Parable, Is Contrary.
• Paul Teaches We Are Eternally Secure, But Jesus Teaches Insecurity to a Sinning Believer.
• Paul Teaches In Original Sin But Jesus Contradicts.
• Paul Denies Obedience Grants Any Righteousness Unto Life, But Jesus & Exodus 20:6 Both Says It Does.
• Jesus Sends The Apostles to Baptize, But Paul Says Jesus Did Not Send Him to Baptize.
• Jesus Says Only the Merciful Receive Mercy, But Paul Says Only Those God Chooses Arbitrarily Will Receive Mercy.
• Paul Says Salvation Does Not Depend Upon Exertion, But Jesus Says It Does.
• Paul Says He Could Be Justified of The Sin that Never Could be Justified under the Law given Moses (Blasphemy), but Jesus says to the contrary that it is The Unpardonable Sin.
• Paul Says Flesh will not inherit the Kingdom of God, but Jesus in Flesh ascended to heaven, and promises to resurrect our bodies likewise to the Kingdom of the New Jerusalem, giving us the same physical resurrection that Jesus had.
https://www.jesuswordsonly.com/books/175-pauls-contradictions-of-jesus.html
@ghost-of-a-duke saidInteresting list. I know some of them. Some are frivolous but some are very serious. This is a pitfall for the weak and lazy Christian who simply listen to the teachings of the pastor without reading the bible for themselves. If there appears to be contradiction then the solution is to lean on the side of Christ.
Jesus Says Not To Eat Meat Sacrificed to Idols, But Paul Says It Is Ok.
• Jesus Says The Law Continues, But Paul Says No.
• Paul Says The Pharisees Followed The Law Rigorously, But Jesus Says They Were Lax About The Law.
• Jesus Says Salvation Initiates And Continues By Repentance From Sin and Obedience Besides Faith; Paul Says This is Heresy.
• Jesus Tell ...[text shortened]... ion that Jesus had.
https://www.jesuswordsonly.com/books/175-pauls-contradictions-of-jesus.html
@rajk999 saidGood job you’re not a “weak lazy Christian” isn’t it?
Interesting list. I know some of them. Some are frivolous but some are very serious. This is a pitfall for the weak and lazy Christian who simply listen to the teachings of the pastor without reading the bible for themselves. If there appears to be contradiction then the solution is to lean on the side of Christ.
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12 Dec 20
@ghost-of-a-duke saidIf you take everything said out of context...
Jesus Says Not To Eat Meat Sacrificed to Idols, But Paul Says It Is Ok.
• Jesus Says The Law Continues, But Paul Says No.
• Paul Says The Pharisees Followed The Law Rigorously, But Jesus Says They Were Lax About The Law.
• Jesus Says Salvation Initiates And Continues By Repentance From Sin and Obedience Besides Faith; Paul Says This is Heresy.
• Jesus Tell ...[text shortened]... ion that Jesus had.
https://www.jesuswordsonly.com/books/175-pauls-contradictions-of-jesus.html
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12 Dec 20
@dj2becker saidOkay, explain this anomaly in context:
If you take everything said out of context...
Jesus said the one who repents from sin is justified. (Parable of the Publican and the Pharisee. Luke 18:10-14.) While Paul said one is not justified nor born again by repentance from sin, but by faith alone. (Romans 3:28 etc).
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12 Dec 20
@ghost-of-a-duke saidEasily explained with faith going hand in hand with repentance. Paul never said repentance doesn’t follow where there is faith.
Okay, explain this anomaly in context:
Jesus said the one who repents from sin is justified. (Parable of the Publican and the Pharisee. Luke 18:10-14.) While Paul said one is not justified nor born again by repentance from sin, but by faith alone. (Romans 3:28 etc).
12 Dec 20
@divegeester saidNO. The church promotes a false gospel of Paul.
So Paul preaches a false gospel then?
12 Dec 20
@divegeester saidDefinitely not. I read the bible. I focus on the teachings of Christ. I do not listen to the teachings of men, pastors, priests etc. You should try it too.
Good job you’re not a “weak lazy Christian” isn’t it?
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@dj2becker
Yes, faith on our side means nothing if God is not faithful.
Faith increases as we learn on deeper levels that God is faithful to His word.
Amazingly, we in our natural fallen being have little to no faith in God.
Jesus called His disciples "O you of little faith" (Matt. 8:26)
I have learned that I can go somewhere to GET faith. That is to the word of God I can go to obtain faith. So if a man does not want faith he should avoid the word of God.
What is effective in building faith is the word accompanied with our thanksgiving and praise. That is very effective in different situations to enhancing, strengthening faith.
I am glad you included "So faith comes out of hearing, and hearing through the word of Christ." (Rom. 10:17)
Hearing the word of God with an opened heart and a life willing to be changed by God will cause faith to be planted and watered and nourished in the heart.
Faith also works through love. It is good to tell the Lord Jesus that you love Him. Sometimes by brute confession with no particular present warm feeling. Then faith works by love.
[b]"For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision avails anything nor uncircumcision, but faith avails, operating through love." (Gal. 5:6).
Like this: "Lord Jesus, I love You. Lord I just love You."
This and hearing the word of God, faith will grow.