19 Aug 12
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Originally posted by kevcvs57No, you're on the wrong track here.
Thanks for trying to square that particular circle, but I am not sure about Bible God relying on the authorities ability to apprehend a wrong doer.
One of the reasons that punishments were so harsh was they had to do the heavy lifting in terms of deterrent due to it being very difficult to lay hands on people in a world without photofit or an actual pol the authorities. "
Can you think of a reason why Satan would help kick start Christianity?
Judas may have been a pawn, but definitely not a pawn of God.
Judas was indeed the pivot in this story, but anyone could have been this pivot.
Satan's circle of influence is Earth. Not Heaven. He was not privy to God's plan. All he wanted was to remove Christ from his circle of influence. Satan is kind of a two-trick pony. His plan was to seduce Christ with worldly treasures, and when that didn't work, all he could think of was to eliminate Him.* I'm sure he didn't realize the cost to him to see Christ dead, or if he did, he was sure of his own ability to contain the damage. Some would say he's had his fingers in the RCC from the beginning.
* "I made damned sure Pilate
washed his hands and sealed His fate." -- Sympathy for the Devil, The Rolling Stones
19 Aug 12
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Originally posted by SuzianneMan is not so great for sure. That is why I rail against religions, every one invented by evil men in the first place, seeing a way to pull off the biggest pyramid schemes of all times.
I'm gonna leave a lot of your reply unanswered as it's merely your try to show that I am somehow "brainwashed". Thanks for giving me a benefit of a doubt that I may know my own mind. But then that isn't your agenda, is it?
[quote]I would love nothing more than to destroy all man made religions and the wars they engender and the misery they have caused wo e brought about by weak and evil men. Yes, other men. Man is not so great then, is he?
Why don't you read about the Gospel of Judas:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gospel_of_Judas
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2006/04/0406_060406_judas_2.html
BTW, your comment about the Gnostic gospels as being Buddhist was way off the mark. You should read them yourself before making such grand sweeping statements.
The Gnostics were just as Christian as any of the Nicea crowd, who were, after all, more concerned with keeping control of the population than in any real spiritual advancement.
19 Aug 12
Originally posted by Suzianne"No, you're on the wrong track here."
No, you're on the wrong track here.
Judas may have been a pawn, but definitely not a pawn of God.
Judas was indeed the pivot in this story, but anyone could have been this pivot.
Satan's circle of influence is Earth. Not Heaven. He was not privy to God's plan. All he wanted was to remove Christ from his circle of influence. Satan is kind of a t ...[text shortened]... ed his hands and sealed His fate." -- Sympathy for the Devil, The Rolling Stones
It's ok I have had over half a century to adapt to that reality.
I and probably other non theists who think about Satan's/Evils role in Christianity struggle to make the distinction between Him/it and the rest of supposed creation.
He just seems too convenient for God/Christianity, a handy hook to hang the blame for a lack of internal logic within the belief system. They are very much the double act, or the disease and the cure, only in this case the cure seems to have created the disease in order to give itself a raison detre.
Odd very Odd.😕
20 Aug 12
Originally posted by sonhousesome christians. not "you christians"
Christians let themselves be ruled by clerics from the council of Nicea hundreds of years after Christ died. They decided what we in the 21st century is your god's word. So you can't read the Gospel of Judas or the Gnostic gospels because people 1800 years ago just said you can't.
And you christians think you think for yourselves. Amazing dichotomy you have there.
20 Aug 12
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Originally posted by sonhouseNo, the Gnostics have a LOT different from the Christians. Maybe you should research them a little past these so-called "Gnostic Gospels".
BTW, your comment about the Gnostic gospels as being Buddhist was way off the mark. You should read them yourself before making such grand sweeping statements.
The Gnostics were just as Christian as any of the Nicea crowd, who were, after all, more concerned with keeping control of the population than in any real spiritual advancement.
Go read anything about what they believe. And see if it doesn't more remind you of Buddhists than Christians. I do not think I was so "way off the mark".
20 Aug 12
Originally posted by VoidSpiritThis is simply not true. If you see God as evil, it's only a measure of where your yardstick is.
nothing new here, the bible has several stories of god inspiring people to do evil.
The Bible does have lots and lots of stories of men behaving badly, though. God is not evil. God shown through the filter of evil men, however, may cause some to think He is evil. But again, this is why there is Free Will, so none can blame God. The blame is man's, not God's. Even though Satan pushes man to do evil, evil is only done by weak men. This has nothing to do with God.
20 Aug 12
Originally posted by sonhouseThey were rejected as not being written by men inspired by God. However, there is no prohibition against reading them. In fact you can read them today. I have a compilation of them in my own library. It is named "THE OTHER BIBLE Ancient Esoteric Texts" edited by Willis Barnstone. It includes the Jewish Pseudepigrapha, Christian Apocrypha, Gnostic Scripture, Kabbalah, and the Dead Sea Scrolls. It does not include anything supposedly written by Judas, but I am sure some Satanic organization must have that one to sell you.
All of which goes to prove my point, you are letting humans from 1800 years ago rule your life not the word of some god. There were plenty of other gospels lost to us now that were also rejected, you can never read them to decide if they were god inspired or not, and for instance, the recently discovered gospel of Judas is taken as complete nonsense now but ...[text shortened]... nspire me, let that god do it, not some human scam artist with an agenda to control humans.
20 Aug 12
Originally posted by SuzianneIf you're not Gnostic, does that makes you...
First of all Gnosticism is complete crap. Any of that dogma was not included because we are Christians, not Gnostics. The last thing I need clogging up my head is some foolish mix of Christianity and Buddhism. Such heresy has no place in Christendom, and I really doubt if there is a place for a Gospel of a man so weak that he was influenced by Satan to t ...[text shortened]... see where you are coming from and can treat what you say with the grain of salt it deserves.
Agnostic?
20 Aug 12
Originally posted by RJHindsWhy don't you go to the link I provided? You sound like you think the Gospel of Judas was made up. It was recently found and translated, and is in an issue of National Geographic. It tells that Judas was ORDERED by Jesus to do what he did, not a disgrace to christians but a hero.
They were rejected as not being written by men inspired by God. However, there is no prohibition against reading them. In fact you can read them today. I have a compilation of them in my own library. It is named "THE OTHER BIBLE Ancient Esoteric Texts" edited by Willis Barnstone. It includes the Jewish Pseudepigrapha, Christian Apocrypha, Gnostic Script ...[text shortened]... edly written by Judas, but I am sure some Satanic organization must have that one to sell you.
20 Aug 12
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Originally posted by sonhouseYes I do. Judas is reported to have died shortly after the betrayal by two accepted Biblical sources. So I believe somebody forged his name of the writing. Satan is good at trying to deceive people. 😏
Why don't you go to the link I provided? You sound like you think the Gospel of Judas was made up. It was recently found and translated, and is in an issue of National Geographic. It tells that Judas was ORDERED by Jesus to do what he did, not a disgrace to christians but a hero.