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24 Feb 10
Originally posted by robbie carrobieThank you. These confirm that faith requires a constant re-affirmation. Faith must be practiced day by day and we should not become too lax and complacent believing that salvation has been gained by a single confession of faith.
(1 Corinthians 10:12) . . .Consequently let him that thinks he is standing beware that he does not fall. . .
(Galatians 6:1) Brothers, even though a man takes some false step before he is aware of it, you who have spiritual qualifications try to readjust such a man in a spirit of mildness, as you each keep an eye on yourself, for fear you also may be tempted
24 Feb 10
1 edit
Originally posted by Conrau KThats a good point , the essence of which should be practiced in all religons, and in life in general for that matter. Thanks Conreau K. As I've indicated before I'm very impressed by your approach to spiritualtiy
Thank you. These confirm that faith requires a constant re-affirmation. Faith must be practiced day by day and we should not become too lax and complacent believing that salvation has been gained by a single confession of faith.
24 Feb 10
1 edit
Originally posted by Conrau KThanks, CK, that clears some things up for me concerning Catholic belief. I find that my own beliefs about salvation aren't really any different. If it wasn't for the fact that the Catholic Church destroyed the lives of so many of my family and friends, I would probably be a Catholic myself.
[b]Another aside: If I understand you correctly, you are saying that the life of Christ (i.e., the "seed" in 1 John 3:9) is freely given to those who are born again; and to "cut off" (as in Rom. 11:20-22) entails God choosing to take back that seed (i.e. the life of Christ) which was given. Am I correct?
Not quite. I agree that Jesus Christ is a gif mple fact that he or she does not or has ceased to practice repentance?[/b]
Yes.[/b]
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25 Feb 10
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Originally posted by epiphinehasThanks, CK, that clears some things up for me concerning Catholic belief. I find that my own beliefs about salvation aren't really any different.
Thanks, CK, that clears some things up for me concerning Catholic belief. I find that my own beliefs about salvation aren't really any different. If it wasn't for the fact that the Catholic Church destroyed the lives of so many of my family and friends, I would probably be a Catholic myself.
Yes, I think this is an area where Catholic-Protestant dialogue has achieved real success. Only a few years ago, the Catholic-Lutheran conference for ecumenical dialogue produced a joint declaration showing that these church really do not differ much in soteriology. It was quite ground-breaking because meant that Catholics could now study Luther positively as a person with real theological insight and not a rebellious heretic.
If it wasn't for the fact that the Catholic Church destroyed the lives of so many of my family and friends, I would probably be a Catholic myself.
I am sorry to hear that. I really am. In defense, all I can is that the Catholic Church has only ever helped me. A priest provided for me so that I could finish high school and I am forever in gratitude. I am sorry for whatever pain has been caused to you.
25 Feb 10
Originally posted by buckkyOK, then how about this...
To drab.
Let's say that to 'die' is to return back to a oneness with the universe. Our constituent atoms are released from this temporary arrangement that we recognize as 'ourself' and (in a pantheistic sense) we are dispersed back into the totality of 'god.' To perceive of oneself as a distinct entity, separate from the universe, is to be separated from god. To recognize that we are integral parts of the unified whole, that we are inseparable parts of god and that the divine likewise flows through us, is to accept that the passing of our consciousness is of no great importance.
Is that less drab?
25 Feb 10
Originally posted by rwingettNow I like that. It's full of spice !
OK, then how about this...
Let's say that to 'die' is to return back to a oneness with the universe. Our constituent atoms are released from this temporary arrangement that we recognize as 'ourself' and (in a pantheistic sense) we are dispersed back into the totality of 'god.' To perceive of oneself as a distinct entity, separate from the universe, is to ...[text shortened]... t that the passing of our consciousness is of no great importance.
Is that less drab?
26 Feb 10
1 edit
Originally posted by epiphinehas[/b]
Another aside: If I understand you correctly, you are saying that the life of Christ (i.e., the "seed" in 1 John 3:9) is freely given to those who are born again; and to "cut off" (as in Rom. 11:20-22) entails God choosing to take back that seed (i.e. the life of Christ) which was given. Am I correct?
[b]Because, as we can see from experience, Christ wn by the simple fact that he or she does not or has ceased to practice repentance?
I think we need to consider what Paul means more carefully than the "cutting off" in the sense of individual salvation. This is a kind of national and collective matter he is speaking of which I don't think is exactly a matter of loss of individual salvation.
Notice:
"I say then, Has God cast away His people? Absolutely not! For I also am an Israelite, out of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin." (Rom 11:1)
Though Paul is talking about the "cutting off" and the "grafting in" of ethnic groups or national groups, he is careful to point out that on an individual basis an individual can be saved.
I don't think this discussion in Romans 11 is akin to making the regenerated unregenerated or removing the divine seed from within those who have received it.
26 Feb 10
I don't think this discussion in Romans 11 is akin to making the regenerated unregenerated or removing the divine seed from within those who have received it.
Would it be your opinion then that those who fall away from the faith have never truly received the life of Christ to begin with? And those who have been imbued with the life of Christ simply cannot choose to reject the gift that was given?
27 Feb 10
Originally posted by epiphinehas===================================
[b]I don't think this discussion in Romans 11 is akin to making the regenerated unregenerated or removing the divine seed from within those who have received it.
Would it be your opinion then that those who fall away from the faith have never truly received the life of Christ to begin with? And those who have been imbued with the life of Christ simply cannot choose to reject the gift that was given?[/b]
Would it be your opinion then that those who fall away from the faith have never truly received the life of Christ to begin with? And those who have been imbued with the life of Christ simply cannot choose to reject the gift that was given?
=====================================
Once a person is born, he cannot be unborn.
My earthly father is my father. His life has produced me. Now we may go through a period when we are not on very friendly terms. But he cannot change the fact that I am his son. Neither can I change the fact that his life has produced me.
You and I are Christians. Many times we "fell away". If God has not forsaken us by now then we may be assured that He still owns us as His sons.
Big failers like you and me are still children of God?? Our eternal redemption is secure.
27 Feb 10
Originally posted by jaywillGood stuff.
[b]===================================
Would it be your opinion then that those who fall away from the faith have never truly received the life of Christ to begin with? And those who have been imbued with the life of Christ simply cannot choose to reject the gift that was given?
=====================================
Once a person is born, he ...[text shortened]...
Big failers like you and me are still children of God?? Our eternal redemption is secure.[/b]