20 Jun 09
2 edits
It is more like this. You start to read someting in the Bible with a prayerful attitude. (That is very important).
Let's say you are reading something about Noah's flood. You ask yourself "I wonder if this flood was over the whole planet or just local."
But the Holy Spirit impresses you with this instead "You know the way you spoke to your wife yesterday was not kind. You should go and apologize."
But you ignore the thought because you are more occupied with some scientific information about Noah's flood. Now if you ignore that prompting you will make no progress spiritually no matter how much you study about Noah's flood.
If on the other hand you say "Just maybe that was God speaking to me." And you go and apologize to your wife. Victory, progress, PEACE, advancement, more God has been dispensed into your being.
And with that more understanding of the Bible. You learn to focus on the things that the Holy Spirit teaches you to focus on. This kind of person will grow to have deeper and deeper insight into the Bible.
It is a book of life.
Now you can also be curious and study other things. But the burden of the Spirit of God is primarily how to transform your life. That is transform you more and more into the image of Jesus Christ.
From Genesis to Revelation the Bible is a book of life, of spiritual life.
20 Jun 09
Originally posted by FabianFnasI regard this as just a skeptic's wishful view.
Yes, and nothing more.
It's not a book of science. It's not a book that knows things.
I't just a book.
That is that he can easily dismiss the Bible as not being important or relevant. I wish you didn't have that attitude. But that's another story.
By the way. Why are you here ? I mean why are you here in the universe ?
I got my answers from the Bible. Where did you find out about the meaning of your life ?
20 Jun 09
Originally posted by jaywillWhy do you assume life must "have meaning"?
I regard this as just a skeptic's wishful view.
That is that he can easily dismiss the Bible as not being important or relevant. I wish you didn't have that attitude. But that's another story.
By the way. Why are you here ? I mean why are you here in the universe ?
I got my answers from the Bible. Where did you find out about the meaning of your life ?
20 Jun 09
Originally posted by jaywillWhen I asked the same question to a fundamentalist who littered the Science Forum, he just answered: "I have the right to be here!" I give you the same answer.
I regard this as just a skeptic's wishful view.
That is that he can easily dismiss the Bible as not being important or relevant. I wish you didn't have that attitude. But that's another story.
By the way. Why are you here ? I mean why are you here in the universe ?
I got my answers from the Bible. Where did you find out about the meaning of your life ?
Yes, I am very skeptic to take the bible too seriously. Genisis is a buch of fabels who fundamentalists tend to see as scientific truths. They are not. The rest of the OT is about politics in those days in those areas. Has no bearing of times of today, more than to give authority to people who wants to take others land away from them, with force, violence, even killings. The evangelies is about a good mans philosophy. The letters is one mans views, showing the ideas of that time. The last book in NT is more like a hallucinations about the last days of Earth. What part do you want to take seriously? I rather read the Ring Trilogy.
Are you sure you get the right answer from the bible? I mean, really sure? How do you know that?
20 Jun 09
Originally posted by FabianFnasIts more than 'just a book'
Yes, and nothing more.
It's not a book of science. It's not a book that knows things.
I't just a book.
I know that and I'm not even a christian
Some books have deeper meaning in them( to say the least)
The bible is particularly study-worthy because it seems to have so many positive,negative and non-dualist views in it
20 Jun 09
Originally posted by karoly aczelSo is the Quaran, so is the book of Veda, so is the lord of the Ring, so are a loot of books. There are wisdom in oh so many books. The bible is only one of them.
Its more than 'just a book'
I know that and I'm not even a christian
Some books have deeper meaning in them( to say the least)
The bible is particularly study-worthy because it seems to have so many positive,negative and non-dualist views in it
But the bible is also racistic, worshipping violence and wars, it has a lot of passages about hatred, and.. and... and...
20 Jun 09
Originally posted by FabianFnasYep.
So is the Quaran, so is the book of Veda, so is the lord of the Ring, so are a loot of books. There are wisdom in oh so many books. The bible is only one of them.
But the bible is also racistic, worshipping violence and wars, it has a lot of passages about hatred, and.. and... and...
I bow to your point (or hwever you want to put it)
The vedas?... I have not heard it mentioned on this forum yet
Any other views on this most magnificant of subjects?
20 Jun 09
2 edits
Originally posted by Conrau KExactly! Which is why telerion said on here (long, long ago) that we all ought to be more clear about the hermeneutical principles that we bring to bear in our interpretations. Mea culpa! I do not always do that as well as I could.
So if logic does not apply to the Bible, how can you possibly interpret it? Surely any interpretation is equally valid.
20 Jun 09
Originally posted by FabianFnas======================
When I asked the same question to a fundamentalist who littered the Science Forum, he just answered: "I have the right to be here!" I give you the same answer.
Yes, I am very skeptic to take the bible too seriously. Genisis is a buch of fabels who fundamentalists tend to see as scientific truths. They are not. The rest of the OT is about politics in th ...[text shortened]... e you sure you get the right answer from the bible? I mean, really sure? How do you know that?
When I asked the same question to a fundamentalist who littered the Science Forum, he just answered: "I have the right to be here!" I give you the same answer.
===========================
That sounds like another way of saying its none of my business. You have the right, that's all.
20 Jun 09
1 edit
Originally posted by jaywillLittle pompous answers like that reflect poorly on you.
If you don't think it does you're free to say so.
You won't be the first.
Why can't it be that God just gave us to life to live? Is it so insignificant to live this life, that it has to have some extra meaning? Is the gift of life really so unsatisfying that we have to make up reasons for living and spend all our time thinking about them? I love my life. If I were looking for its so called "meaning" all the time, I would diagnose myself as insecure, unhappy, and afraid of death.
Spirituality is NOT exclusively about finding "meaning".
20 Jun 09
Originally posted by FMFFMF: “Is it so insignificant to live this life, that it has to have some extra meaning?” [My bold.]
Little pompous answers like that reflect poorly on you.
Why can't it be that God just gave us to life to live? Is it so insignificant to live this life, that it has to have some extra meaning? Is the gift of life really so unsatisfying that we have to make up reasons for living and spend all our time thinking about them? I love my life. If I were looking for ...[text shortened]... , unhappy, and afraid of death.
Spirituality is NOT exclusively about finding "meaning".
In the 5 or so years that I’ve been on here—and during which time this whole question has been debated many times—you are the first person (in my memory) that has thought to add that little (but bold) word “extra”! That’s it exactly!
Does a symphony (to use Alan Watts’ example*) have to have some extra meaning? Or is the symphony “meaningful” in/as itself?
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* Watts quipped that, if the point of a symphony concert were to get to the end of it (in analogy: the “afterlife” ), then the fastest-playing musicians would always be considered the best.
20 Jun 09
Originally posted by jaywillWell, I wouldn't put it so. But I think every subject should be seen on with different eyes. I don't mind religious people, but I do mind fundamental stupid people.
That sounds like another way of saying its none of my business. You have the right, that's all.
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20 Jun 09
1 edit
Originally posted by FabianFnasYou are probably right that there are contradictions. But remember that this thread is about how the Bible is somehow outside logic. I can't even fathom what that means exactly. What does it mean to say it is outside of logic? My point though is that if we do not have logic, then anything goes. A translator could say that his interpretation is equally valid as the opposite. And since there is no logic, this is perfectly acceptable.
Now we're off topic. This is a debate about how contradiction can exist in something that is illogical. This is not my line of arguing.
I just say that the bible is illogical.
Or I say there are contradictions in the bible.
In either way I say that the bible is confusing. Building a religion aout of something this confusing is stupid. Explaining the bible as it would be all true is nonsensical.
Anyway, I don't think that is what the OP means. I think what he means is that there are apparent inconsistencies in the Bible and the best way to resolve that is by consulting a minister and adopting a prayerful attitude to the Bible.