06 Mar 10
1 edit
Originally posted by Badwaterso what? Jo jo has stated that Christianity and its adherents have opposed moral progress, here are a series of examples which demonstrate that many were incited to moral progress because of their Christianity. No one has stated that it is exclusively the only source of morality.
The Judeo-Christian beliefs are hardly the only source of so-called morality. Moreover, the Christian churches have been fully on both sides of the morality fence; being progressive on the one hand, and obstructionist on the other. Both sides can cite numerous examples. So what?
06 Mar 10
The Catholic church is against gay rights, birth control and stem cell research. It was also against lightning rods, small pox vaccine, and dissection of cadavers for medical education and the advancement of medicine. It was also against Galileo. The church's position is not mitigated by the fact that Galileo was a Cahtolic.
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06 Mar 10
Originally posted by 667joeIt was also against lightning rods, small pox vaccine, and dissection of cadavers for medical education and the advancement of medicine.
The Catholic church is against gay rights, birth control and stem cell research. It was also against lightning rods, small pox vaccine, and dissection of cadavers for medical education and the advancement of medicine. It was also against Galileo. The church's position is not mitigated by the fact that Galileo was a Cahtolic.
The Catholic Church has never opposed any of these things.
It was also against Galileo.
No; it was against the idea that the Scripture was not inerrant. The Catholic Church had already allowed Galileo to publish his ideas as speculation; they had also allowed similar publications before hand. The supposed conflict with science is greatly exaggerated.
06 Mar 10
3 edits
Originally posted by 667joeJoe, that does not support your premise that moral progress in society has always been blocked by Christians.
For example, right now, the Christians are doing everything they can to block gays from fully enjoying the civil right of marriage.
At most you can sound off that you consider some Christians wrong on this issue or on that issue.
Your example does not substantiate your broad brushed generalization.
A generation like you is rising up now. "To have faith in God is not rational" "To be a Christian is to block moral progress."
You are paving the way for the coming Antichrist. Of that I have no doubt.
06 Mar 10
Originally posted by Conrau KNext you will deny that the Church burned witches, and I am quite sure that had you been alive at the time, you would have been in favor of it ( unless of course, you were found to be a witch!)
[b]It was also against lightning rods, small pox vaccine, and dissection of cadavers for medical education and the advancement of medicine.
The Catholic Church has never opposed any of these things.
It was also against Galileo.
No; it was against the idea that the Scripture was not inerrant. The Catholic Church had already allowed Gali ...[text shortened]... wed similar publications before hand. The supposed conflict with science is greatly exaggerated.[/b]
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06 Mar 10
1 edit
Originally posted by 667joeActually, the Catholic Church did not burn witches. This bizarre phenomena of witch-hunts was largely a Protestant event confined to Germany, Europe and later America in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries. You will find that the Catholic Church was skeptical of claims to witchery, condemning works like Malleus Maleficarum' (concerning the existence of witches) in 1486.
Next you will deny that the Church burned witches, and I am quite sure that had you been alive at the time, you would have been in favor of it ( unless of course, you were found to be a witch!)
Do you have any evidence for the claims you make? You assert that the Catholic Church burns witches, bans use of electricity rods and small pox vaccines. Where do you get this?
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07 Mar 10
2 edits
Originally posted by 667joeI do acknowledge that Catholic priests have molested altar boys. I do not deny the scandal of clerical sex abuse. I do not see how this bears on the current discussion, however. You have made several claims, that the Catholic Church opposed the dissection of cadavers, the use of vaccination and lightning rods and even engaged in witch-hunts. I do not deny that Catholics have sinned terribly; I just ask that you give evidence of these specific claims.
I predicted your answer. I suppose Catholic priests don't molest alter boys either.
I think there is a basic hypocrisy in your behaviour. You frequently insist on the need for probative evidence to support any positive assertions -- that is, for example, theists have the burden of proof to show that God exists, that certain historical claims are factual and so on. Yet, when you make historical claims, you completely discard those evidential standards. All I am asking is that you cite some authorities to give credence to your claims. Why is that so hard?
The fact is that even the atheists on this site are not sympathetic to your inanities. You act as if the ambassador of reason and science but all you do is make wild, hysterical allegations against religions without any facts, any use of evidence, or anything that could be called scientific.
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07 Mar 10
Originally posted by Conrau KBy Europe, I had meant to write England by the way. My latent Anglophilia is slowly surfacing.
Actually, the Catholic Church did not burn witches. This bizarre phenomena of witch-hunts was largely a Protestant event confined to Germany, Europe and later America in the sixteenth and seventeenth centuries. You will find that the Catholic Church was skeptical of claims to witchery, condemning works like Malleus Maleficarum' (concerning the ...[text shortened]... urch burns witches, bans use of electricity rods and small pox vaccines. Where do you get this?
07 Mar 10
Originally posted by Conrau KIf you google catholic church witch burning, you will find that at a minimum, the inquisition had caused the burning of at least several thousand witches and possibly several hundred thousand. Protestant witch burnings were very rare. They preferred hanging or drowning. This facts are better documented than the existence of the god in whose name these crimes were performed with the participation of the nimrods of the day. The facts, I am sorry to say, are not very polite.
By Europe, I had meant to write England by the way. My latent Anglophilia is slowly surfacing.
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07 Mar 10
1 edit
Originally posted by 667joeGoogle does not constitute a very high standard of evidence. It only links to sites which match the search query; it makes no assessment of the authority of these sites.
If you google catholic church witch burning, you will find that at a minimum, the inquisition had caused the burning of at least several thousand witches and possibly several hundred thousand. Protestant witch burnings were very rare. They preferred hanging or drowning. This facts are better documented than the existence of the god in whose name these c ...[text shortened]... the participation of the nimrods of the day. The facts, I am sorry to say, are not very polite.
By the way, you also claimed that the Catholic Church opposed vaccination, lightning rods and the dissection of cadavers. No evidence for these claims has been forthcoming yet.
07 Mar 10
Originally posted by Conrau KGive me a break. I trust google in this matter more than I trust a person who believes he has a supernatural friend looking out for him.
Google does not constitute a very high standard of evidence. It only links to sites which match the search query; it makes no assessment of the authority of these sites.
By the way, you also claimed that the Catholic Church opposed vaccination, lightning rods and the dissection of cadavers. No evidence for these claims has been forthcoming yet.