Science and religion

karoly aczel,

So you know via experience. Now we all do that. If I know there is an apple in my fruit bowl, I didn't deduce that it was there, I just know by looking, smelling, feeling, tasting and so on.

But then the question might be asked of me, is is sensible for me to say that this is knowledge? Do I really know that there is an apple in my fruit bowl? Can I justify this claim to knowledge?

I would answer that I have good reasons to believe that the apple is there, and cutting a long story short, I think it is rational for me to hold that belief.

But in your case, even though what you say might be an accurate portrayal of an alternate reality, I don't see how it is rational for you to suppose that it is.

In other words, you might know it, but I don't see how you can know that you know it.

Originally posted by Lord Shark
karoly aczel,

So you know via experience. Now we all do that. If I know there is an apple in my fruit bowl, I didn't deduce that it was there, I just know by looking, smelling, feeling, tasting and so on.

But then the question might be asked of me, is is sensible for me to say that this is knowledge? Do I really know that there is an apple in my fru ...[text shortened]... is.

In other words, you might know it, but I don't see how you can know that you know it.

Originally posted by karoly aczel
How can I not know it?
(and yes, it is probably not a traditionally rational claim but heck- these aren't such rational times now are they?)

It is easy not to know that you know something. Some would say it is necessary, unless you know something a priori. But more importantly, when you reflect on your experience, do you think your interpretation that an alternate reality has been revealed to you, is reasonable?

As for not being in rational times, wasn't it ever thus?

Originally posted by Lord Shark
Originally posted by karoly aczel
[b]How can I not know it?
(and yes, it is probably not a traditionally rational claim but heck- these aren't such rational times now are they?)

It is easy not to know that you know something. Some would say it is necessary, unless you know something a priori. But more importantly, when you reflect on your ...[text shortened]... en revealed to you, is reasonable?

As for not being in rational times, wasn't it ever thus?[/b]

Originally posted by karoly aczel
1. Yeah I think its reasonable
But you have already admitted that it isn't a rational claim. Why is it reasonable to abandon reason? Isn't there a contradiction there?

2.I 'beleive' these times that we live in are very extraordinary.
I agree that there are some extraordinary elements.

Originally posted by Lord Shark
Originally posted by karoly aczel
[b]1. Yeah I think its reasonable
But you have already admitted that it isn't a rational claim. Why is it reasonable to abandon reason? Isn't there a contradiction there?

2.I 'beleive' these times that we live in are very extraordinary.
I agree that there are some extraordinary elements.[/b]

Originally posted by karoly aczel
I told you I didn't want to debate it.
Whoops.

I'm just starting from a premise,(say the trancendental nature od God), and going from there.
Well, that's game over anyway then :-)

Originally posted by Lord Shark
Originally posted by karoly aczel
[b]I told you I didn't want to debate it.
Whoops.

I'm just starting from a premise,(say the trancendental nature od God), and going from there.
Well, that's game over anyway then :-)[/b]