The Bible and an Ancient Earth

twhitehead,

You may have case - maybe.

Which group do you see yourself fitting into so that you need no repentence and faith in Christ?

Originally posted by jaywill
"Behold, we are going up to Jerusalem, and the Son of Man will be delivered to the chief priests and to the scribes. And they will condemn Him to death and deliver Him to the Gentiles. And they will mock Him and spit at Him and scourge HIm, and they will kill HIm.

And after three days He will rise" (Mark 10:32-24)

Originally posted by Nemesio
You have misunderstood me. I didn't say that I thought everything that Saint Mark wrote is necessarily
historically accurate. I think that this particular passage you cited is an example of an author's
putting words into Jesus' mouth to give Him prophetic authority. It is a reflection of Saint Mark's
faith in the power of God and His Son, Jesus, that ...[text shortened]... the author's understanding of Jesus than biographical date about Jesus Himself.

Nemesio

Originally posted by jaywill
Like the chief priests, Pharisees and the scribes, you don't believe in the what Christ said about Himself.

They opposed Him and you also oppose Him. The only difference between you and the opposing Pharisees is that you are trying to re-create another "Jesus" in your own unbelieving image.

I hope you don't think I'll be particularly impres ...[text shortened]... you find obectionable until you recreate a "Jesus" which suites your skeptical unbelief.

Originally posted by jaywill
Like the chief priests, Pharisees and the scribes, you don't believe in the what Christ said about Himself.

They opposed Him and you also oppose Him. The only difference between you and the opposing Pharisees is that you are trying to re-create another "Jesus" in your own unbelieving image.

I hope you don't think I'll be particularly impres ...[text shortened]... you find obectionable until you recreate a "Jesus" which suites your skeptical unbelief.

Originally posted by whodey
LOL. This reminds me of a supposide theologian I saw on the history channel commenting on the four gospels in referrence to the last supper. Throughout the entire segment he espoused disbelief regarding the historical accuracy of the Bible. Some of his comments seemed somewhat believable, but many seemed down right contrived. At the very end he said that ...[text shortened]... of his life to studying what he deems to be all lies. What a miserable human being he must be.

Originally posted by jaywill
You have to understand that some people go to theological seminary to [b] hide from God, not to find God.

They reason that if they can lose God in a theological seminary they can lose Him anywhere.

I think it is an act of desperation for some. Some want to rid themselves of Christ. They think the best place to do that is a theological seminary.[/b]

Originally posted by scottishinnz
And you swallow it whole without critical analysis.

So who is the bigger fool?

Originally posted by pawnhandler
I had not heard this before. Are you referring to people you know personally?

Originally posted by jaywill
You have to understand that some people go to theological seminary to [b] hide from God, not to find God.

They reason that if they can lose God in a theological seminary they can lose Him anywhere.

I think it is an act of desperation for some. Some want to rid themselves of Christ. They think the best place to do that is a theological seminary.[/b]

Originally posted by jaywill
Like the chief priests, Pharisees and the scribes, you don't believe in the what Christ said about Himself.

This is inaccurate. I don't necessarily believe that all of the things attributed to Jesus were in fact
said by Jesus. You take on blind faith (and in spite of text-critical evidence) that the accounts are
in fact wholly trustworthy.

They opposed Him and you also oppose Him. The only difference between you and the opposing Pharisees is that you are trying to re-create another "Jesus" in your own unbelieving image.

There are many other differences between me and the Pharisees. I have said nothing hypocritical,
for example. I work with people in need, for example. I do not parade my faith around like a banner
for people to ogle, for example.

I hope you don't think I'll be particularly impressed that you will whittle away everything from Mark that you find obectionable until you recreate a "Jesus" which suites your skeptical unbelief.

I'm certainly not impressed with the un-inquisitive, carte blanche approach you take to sacred Scripture.
The early Christians -- the disciples of the Disciples -- didn't do that. I see no reason why Christians
should either.

Nemesio

There are only two Christians in the world who completely understand the underlying construction and meaning of these texts—



Unfortunately, they disagree... 😉



(Please note the tongue in cheek, and the fact that I could reword that in many ways, to cover whoever I wanted... Somebody had to drop in a note of humor here... )

This is inaccurate. I don't necessarily believe that all of the things attributed to Jesus were in fact
said by Jesus. You take on blind faith (and in spite of text-critical evidence) that the accounts are in fact wholly trustworthy.


I think the people who talk about "blind faith" are people who have no experience with the Holy Spirit and are themselves blinded by their unbelief.

In in from the outside they interpret our experience as "blind faith." The Apostle Paul knew this and warned us about it:

" And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled in those who are perishing,

In whom the god of this age has blinded the thoughts of the unbelievers that the illuminations of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God, might not shine on them." (2 Cor. 4:3,4)

Perhaps you are in the process of perishing.

Here "the god of this age" is Satan - a being much more intelligent then both of us.

This Satanic spirit has "blinded the thoughts of the unbelievers". So while you suspicion my "blind faith" I caution you concerning the devilish blinding of your thoughts as an unbeliever.

In that case it could be that you are in the process of perishing. For the gospel is veiled by reason of your blinded thoughts.


There are many other differences between me and the Pharisees.

But I think you have a common enemy - Jesus.

This common enemy makes you have many similarities with the ancient unbelieving and opposing Pharisees. They were inter - text opposers. You are external to the text - yet still are in opposition to Christ's ministry.


I have said nothing hypocritical,
for example. I work with people in need, for example. I do not parade my faith around like a banner
for people to ogle, for example.

That's perhaps your weakness.

But if you attack my faith and I defend it - if you count that as parading faith around as a banner, so be it.

Would me laying down and allowing you to step all over it be less "parading it as a banner"?



I'm certainly not impressed with the un-inquisitive, carte blanche approach you take to sacred Scripture.

Oh, I have many questions. Real goods ones too.

My questions may be just different from yours.


The early Christians -- the disciples of the Disciples -- didn't do that. I see no reason why Christians should either.

Your term "Disciples of Disciples" carries with it the assumption that the Master and Teacher - Jesus is gone. Well, we do not believe that the Master of the disciples is dead and gone.

1.) We don't believe that He taught that He would be dead and gone.

2.) We don't believe that that is what actuallu happened - that He was killed and made non-existent.

3.) We don't believe that the first generation disciples believed that He was dead and gone.

4.) We don't believe that subsequent generations of disciples believed that He was dead and gone.

We beleive that some of his opposers believed that He was killed and dead and gone. (I emphasize "some"😉.

And we believe that some subsequent and modern unbelievers who believe that Jesus is dead and gone and that we only have "Disciples of Disciples" left today.

Now what have I repeatedly emphasized here? It is vitally important to remember this teaching - "The last Adam became a life giving Spirit." (1 Cor. 15:45)


Today - I mean today - Jesus Christ in His resurrected form is in a state that He can be known and experienced - He is "life giving Spirit".

"Now the Lord is the Spirit." (2 Cor. 3:17)

Along with your study of textural issues you should also spend at least equal time to get to know by prayer - this life giving Spirit.

This is Jesus Christ in resurrection in His pneumatic form. This is the truth which Satan seeks to blind the thoughts of the modern unelievers against.

Originally posted by jaywill
[b]This is inaccurate. I don't necessarily believe that all of the things attributed to Jesus were in fact
said by Jesus. You take on blind faith (and in spite of text-critical evidence) that the accounts are in fact wholly trustworthy.


I think the people who talk about "blind faith" are people who have no experience with the Holy Spirit and ar ...[text shortened]... seeks to blind the thoughts of the modern unelievers against.[/b]

I have said nothing hypocritical,
for example. I work with people in need, for example.


That is very good and commendable.

You are a strong humanitarian and I respect you for that.

But that is another matter not dealing with the alleged (in your view) lies of the disciples, in writing their account to the world of Jesus Christ.

Is it possible to be a good humanitarian and not feel it necessary to call the Evangelists liars?