04 Jan 13
Originally posted by johnnylongwoodyPlease see Romans 1:19-21 (NIV)
How can you say that when he is supposed to have predicted Hitler
and other events far into the future compared to the time that he lived in?
When it come to that can you prove to me or anyone else that god exists?
No. You can't and neither can anyone else.
19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.
21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened.
You, I and anyone else who looks in the mirror in the morning sees the proof that God exists. All you have to do is look around your world and all that it contains and see the proof that God exists. Have you looked into the night's sky at the cosmos to see the proof that God exists? If we would only contemplate these things and what they signify, we would clearly see that God exists... we are without excuse.
04 Jan 13
Originally posted by kd2aczYou don't seem to think that there could be a different reason for all that?
Please see Romans 1:19-21 (NIV)
19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.
21 For although they knew ...[text shortened]... se things and what they signify, we would clearly see that God exists... we are without excuse.
There is no concrete proof of any god.
You could not prove it in any court of law in any country on this planet.
Go now and try and tell me otherwise.
04 Jan 13
Originally posted by johnnylongwoodyWell, I guess we are at an impasse then. There are many things that can't be proved in a court of law, but that does not negate the truth however... so I won't even go there. As far as the meaning of the scripture, seems pretty straight forward to me. What do you think the verses signify? Do you honestly believe that with all the complexities and magnificent attributes that we have and that are in the world, it is without a creator, God? What further proof is required? What would convince you?
You don't seem to think that there could be a different reason for all that?
There is no concrete proof of any god.
You could not prove it in any court of law in any country on this planet.
Go now and try and tell me otherwise.
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04 Jan 13
Originally posted by kd2aczTo me personally, Jesus is the Son of God, Head of the church, My Lord and Savior, my all in all. He has been highly exalted by God the Father for His obedience and given a name above all names. He is the red thread that runs through all of scripture, the only one who ever loved God to the fullest. That is why He is my Champion and hero.
In Acts 4:8-12 (NIV)
8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Spirit, said to them: “Rulers and elders of the people! 9 If we are being called to account today for an act of kindness shown to a man who was lame and are being asked how he was healed, 10 then know this, you and all the people of Israel: It is by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you cruci ...[text shortened]... o other name under heaven given to mankind by which we must be saved.”
Who is Jesus to you?
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04 Jan 13
Originally posted by johnnylongwoodyYou should read "The New Testament Documents" by F.F. Bruce. It is not proof, but he shows why there is more evidence of scripture than of Plato or Aristotle, or any other historical figure.
You don't seem to think that there could be a different reason for all that?
There is no concrete proof of any god.
You could not prove it in any court of law in any country on this planet.
Go now and try and tell me otherwise.
04 Jan 13
1 edit
Originally posted by kd2aczThe bible is a bunch of fairy stories written by humans over 1600 years.
Well, I guess we are at an impasse then. There are many things that can't be proved in a court of law, but that does not negate the truth however... so I won't even go there. As far as the meaning of the scripture, seems pretty straight forward to me. What do you think the verses signify? Do you honestly believe that with all the complexities and magnifi ...[text shortened]... orld, it is without a creator, God? What further proof is required? What would convince you?
The bible wasn't written by any god.
You are deluded by superstition if you think so.
There's no proof of any god in any religion.
No one can conclusively say that there is.
Quoting verses from a book of fairy tales is not proof.
If there was proof that a god exists then we would know.
He would have revealed himself to us and then there would be no
need for all these different religions.
We would all know then that there is a god and which religion
was the right one.
The fact is we don't because all religions are man made and therefore flawed.
04 Jan 13
Originally posted by checkbaiterExactly my point. It is not proof.
You should read "The New Testament Documents" by F.F. Bruce. It is not proof, but he shows why there is more evidence of scripture than of Plato or Aristotle, or any other historical figure.
No one on this planet can PROVE that there is any god
no matter what religion they claim to belong to.
I believe in real hard concrete irrefutable facts, not opinions or fairy stories.
04 Jan 13
Originally posted by johnnylongwoodyThe irrefutable fact that the sun always was rising in the past means not that the justification for the supposition that it will definitely rise tomorrow is logical, although it is needless to reject the assumption that the theory according to which the sun will rise tomorrow is false. So, kindly please let me know how and by what means do you ensure that any specific theory of yours that is true Herenow, it will be definitely true tomorrow?
Exactly my point. It is not proof.
No one on this planet can PROVE that there is any god
no matter what religion they claim to belong to.
I believe in real hard concrete irrefutable facts, not opinions or fairy stories.
😵
04 Jan 13
Originally posted by black beetleI am talking about facts.
The irrefutable fact that the sun always was rising in the past means not that the justification for the supposition that it will definitely rise tomorrow is logical, although it is needless to reject the assumption that the theory according to which the sun will rise tomorrow is false. So, kindly please let me know how and by what means do you ensure that any specific theory of yours that is true Herenow, it will be definitely true tomorrow?
😵
Are you a clairvoyant? No you are not and neither am I.
I never said anything about tomorrow or any day in the future.
No one can predict the future. I am on about hard facts relevant
to yesterday and today, not tomorrow. Argument is based or should be based
on facts. Not opinions or fairy stories. Facts which can be proven as
you would do in a court of law. Facts which are irrefutable and cannot be
overturned. That is how a court of law operates.
It does not operate on hearsay or opinions or fairy stories. It operates on
solid facts put forward on a firm foundation to establish fact and truth.
Logical argument if you will which when debated stand up to the test of
time and cross examination.
Not superstitious fairy stories.
Now, are you happy with that?
If not I'll send you over the tooth fairy with a bag of silver.
04 Jan 13
Originally posted by johnnylongwoodySend me a 12yo Jameson😵
I am talking about facts.
Are you a clairvoyant? No you are not and neither am I.
I never said anything about tomorrow or any day in the future.
No one can predict the future. I am on about hard facts relevant
to yesterday and today, not tomorrow. Argument is based or should be based
on facts. Not opinions or fairy stories. Facts which ...[text shortened]... ow, are you happy with that?
If not I'll send you over the tooth fairy with a bag of silver.
04 Jan 13
Originally posted by johnnylongwoodyEdit: "No one can predict the future."
I am talking about facts.
Are you a clairvoyant? No you are not and neither am I.
I never said anything about tomorrow or any day in the future.
No one can predict the future. I am on about hard facts relevant
to yesterday and today, not tomorrow. Argument is based or should be based
on facts. Not opinions or fairy stories. Facts which ...[text shortened]... ow, are you happy with that?
If not I'll send you over the tooth fairy with a bag of silver.
BTW, I wonder how do you play chess?! The Royal Game is a series of a constantly changing position (and the game itself is the finest example of what is known as perfect information). The position does not change on its own out of the blue, it changes because each player contributes so that it changes. To state that the prediction of the changes you imply is impossible, holds solely when you don't have a clue about what takes place on the chessboard and, as a result, when your variations are nonsensical and the variations of your opponent keep you constantly slave of his will😵
04 Jan 13
Originally posted by johnnylongwoodyOn the contrary;
The bible is a bunch of fairy stories written by humans over ... [text shortened]... all religions are man made and therefore flawed.
The bible is a bunch of fairy stories written by humans over 1600 years.
The Bible is the inspired word of God written by people over the period of a few thousand years. No fairy tales there my friend, you should stop thinking so.
You are deluded by superstition if you think so.
There is no delusion, only if you think otherwise.
Quoting verses from a book of fairy tales is not proof.
The Bible is not only the word of God, but also a historical document with real people and real places. Again, no fairy tales.
If there was proof that a god exists then we would know.
He would have revealed himself to us and then there would be no
need for all these different religions.
This is probably the most obvious. God did prove his existence in his son Jesus, but people reject. I quick check tells me that Jesus fulfilled approx. 400 OT prophecies pertaining to the coming Messiah. I am not a mathematician, perhaps you can tell me what the probability of that event occurring in Jesus is. I am guessing it is a number far to big for any of us to comprehend. I will also defer to my earlier scripture reference
Romans 1:19-21 (NIV)
19 since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20 For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.
21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened.
Now, could you answer the questions that i previously asked but you overlooked?
What do you think the verses signify?
Do you honestly believe that with all the complexities and magnificent attributes that we have and that are in the world, it is without a creator, God?
What further proof is required?
What would convince you?
04 Jan 13
Originally posted by kd2aczThe Bible is the inspired word of God
On the contrary;
The bible is a bunch of fairy stories written by humans over 1600 years.
The Bible is the inspired word of God written by people over the period of a few thousand years. No fairy tales there my friend, you should stop thinking so.
You are deluded by superstition if you think so.
There is no delusion, on ...[text shortened]... orld, it is without a creator, God?
What further proof is required?
What would convince you?
Can you substantiate that claim?