Originally posted by frogstompRemember, I said three passages from the mouth of Jesus. (Or if you will attributed to Jesus).
Of course you'd say they were weak words, the guy that spoke them was only your God. Maybe you can improve on them by quoting Paul, again.
I do have other examples in mind, from the mouth of Jesus.
I will get around to writing them, since it is only fair that I do improve upon your examples, having criticized them as being too weak.
The reason Frogstomp's examples are weak is of course not because they were spoken by "my God". But they do not really hit the point of the question.
Maybe Frogstomp would excuse them by saying it was my God's fault that Frogstomp is not that familiar with the teachings of Jesus.
Originally posted by jaywillMaybe you might include these words of Christ:
Remember, I said three passages from the mouth of Jesus. (Or if you will attributed to Jesus).
I do have other examples in mind, from the mouth of Jesus.
I will get around to writing them, since it is only fair that I do improve upon your examples, having criticized them as being too weak.
"....When you come to know yourselves, then you will become known, and you will realize that it is you who are the sons of the living Father. But if you will not know yourselves, you dwell in poverty and it is you who are that poverty."
From the mouth of Jesus then. Why did He have to die?
For starters why not go to His speaking at the last supper?
"And as they were sitting, Jesus took bread and blessed it, and He broke it and gave it to the disciples and said, Take, eat, this is My body. And He took a cup and gave thanks, and He gave it to them, saying, Drink of it, all of you.
For this is My blood of the covenant, which is being poured out for many for forgiveness of sins ..." (Matthew 26:26-28)
He is dying to establish "the covenant" in His poured out blood for the forgiveness of the sins of many. He dies for a redemptive purpose. He pours out His blood as a covenant that we may be redeemed from our sins.
Another word from the mouth of Jesus about why He comes to die:
"And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up, That everyone who believes into Him may have eternal life" (John 3:14,15)
This is not the redemptive aspect of Christ's death. It is the Terminating aspect of His death. He draws upon the brass serpent lifted up by Moses Numbers 21:4-9.
The serpent bitten and viper poisoned Israelites were dying of the poison. God told Moses to make a serpent of brass and hang it on a pole. Then Moses was to lift up that brass serpent for the people to see. Whoever was dying of poisoness snake bite would be healed if they would only look upon the brass serpent lifted up on the pole.
Jesus says His being lifted up on the cross is like this lifting up of the brass serpent. The implication is that man is poisoned by the serpent Satan. Jesus dies on the cross in the form of Satan. That is in the form only and not with the serpent's poison. Jesus dies on the cross as the human "brass serpent" that all the Satanic poisoned sinners might be healed if they believe in Him.
The picture is in the Old Testament. The caption underneath the picture is in the New Testament teaching of Jesus. He dies to terminate the Satanic element in man. He dies on the cross. But it is the Serpent Satan who is dealt a defeating blow. Christ dies not only for Redemption but also for Termination.
A third passage from the mouth of Jesus. He dies for Germination. He dies to release the divine life from within Him into many sons of God, the believers:
"Truly, truly, I say to you, Unless the grain of wheat falls into the ground and dies, it abides alone, but if it dies, it bears much fruit" (John 12:24)
The life of God is concealed within the shell of Son of God. He comes to fall into the ground and die. His death will release the divine life concealed within the shell of His humanity. And instead of abiding alone, He will produce many like Himself - the many grains.
Christ dies to duplicate Himself. He dies to release the life that is in Him into many others. He would not "abide alone". He would fall into the ground to die. And in dying He would release the concealed eternal life within Him into many sons of God.
So these three sayings from Jesus show:
1.) He died for Redemption of man from sins according to a new covenant.
2.) He died to for the Termination of the Satanic nature which is poisoning man.
3.) He died for the Germination of many sons of God so that He would not abide alone as the only Son of God. He desired that He have many brothers who share His eternal and divine life and nature.
Originally posted by jaywillI am a bit beyond your passages , try this one it has more meaning than anything said in the synoptics.
Now Frogstomp, It would be interesting to reconsider your three earlier samples and see if they are related to the three passages I have proposed.
"I shall give you what no eye has seen and what no ear has heard and what no hand has touched and what has never occurred to the human mind."
Originally posted by frogstompThat passage is from First Corinthians by Paul and Sosthenes. What translation are you quoting?
I am a bit beyond your passages , try this one it has more meaning than anything said in the synoptics.
"I shall give you what no eye has seen and what no ear has heard and what no hand has touched and what has never occurred to the human mind."
Give me one matter from my three examples which you found not understandable. I would be interested to know what was not clearly explained.
One or two examples of problematic explanations would due. And I am not promising that I can do any better. I understand it.
Originally posted by jaywill"Whoever has ears, let him hear. There is light within a man of light, and he lights up the whole world. If he does not shine, he is darkness."
That passage is from First Corinthians by Paul and Sosthenes. What translation are you quoting?
Give me one matter from my three examples which you found not understandable. I would be interested to know what was not clearly explained.
One or two examples of problematic explanations would due. And I am not promising that I can do any better. I understand it.
Are you one of us?
Originally posted by frogstompI'll leave off our discussion for now. But I would still like to know what English Version of the NT you were quoting.
I am ,I know, but in my defense it's not my doing that made it so.
That is my defence.
Enjoy the rest of your day.
Originally posted by frogstompEnough of this. Why not just come out and tell us a little about your theology froggy. It appears you beileve that Peter is Satan. Great, but what else are your beliefs? Do you even believe there is a God? Do you believe the Bible is the inspired word of God? Do you believe in salvation? Do you believe in Chirsts sacrifice for our sins? Can you or I should say, would you open up a bit instead of asking us a myriad of questions or do you simply like messing with us Chrisitians?
Maybe you might include these words of Christ:
"....When you come to know yourselves, then you will become known, and you will realize that it is you who are the sons of the living Father. But if you will not know yourselves, you dwell in poverty and it is you who are that poverty."