- Joined
- 31 May 06
- Moves
- 1795
27 Feb 15
Originally posted by checkbaiterSo if we create a person who doesn't breath but instead [for example] has a
A person has "soul life" the minute he or she takes their first breath.
They lose their soul life at their last breath.
small inbuilt nuclear reactor that converts CO2 + H2O into O2 and sugar...
That person wouldn't have a soul?
27 Feb 15
1 edit
Originally posted by checkbaiterThe plot thickens it would appear.
A person has "soul life" the minute he or she takes their first breath.
They lose their soul life at their last breath.
We can certainly infer from your statement that a foetus does not have any soul life then (since babies take their first breath *after* being born) - do you support the right of women to have abortions?
But anyway, lets get a little bit more detail ... one question at a time.
Is oxygen comprised of "soul stuff"? (and what is the chemical symbol for soul stuff?)
27 Feb 15
Originally posted by checkbaiterIs it therefore necessary to have a priest in attendance at a birth to ensure that it is a soul and not an evil spirit which takes residence? Of course, this is probably preferable to the requirement that a priest should be present at the moment of conception...
A person has "soul life" the minute he or she takes their first breath.
They lose their soul life at their last breath.
27 Feb 15
Originally posted by DeepThoughtThere is good reason to believe that we will in future be able to coax any cell to change into a stem cell.
To create a clone you need, at the very least, universal stem cells.
A theist would, presumably, argue that this is sufficiently close to fertilization for the soul to be added then.
In other words they would make something up? This could probably not supported it with Bible verses hence the absence of theists actually saying this. Theists have difficulty saying 'I don't know' so you probably won't see them say that either.
Basically what I'm getting at is that this line of argument is just too easily deflected with "God sorts it out".
And a good argument that would be. God might even add a soul to every stem cell ever produced, or he might use his omniscience to only add souls to those entities that eventually grow into actual human beings - thus avoiding the enormous wastage of souls that would take place is every embryo got one (more than half of all embryos do not make it to birth).
The more interesting question is what is a soul? These things, apparently, are different from your mind, so memories aren't included.
Memories apparently can be included, I have been able to extract that much from some theists. But which memories has been a lot more vague.
27 Feb 15
Now the word of the Lord came to me saying,
“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you,
And before you were born I consecrated you;
I have appointed you a prophet to the nations.”
(Jeremiah 1:4-5 NASB)
For You formed my inward parts;
You wove me in my mother’s womb.
I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made;
Wonderful are Your works,
And my soul knows it very well.
My frame was not hidden from You,
When I was made in secret,
And skillfully wrought in the depths of the earth;
Your eyes have seen my unformed substance;
And in Your book were all written
The days that were ordained for me,
When as yet there was not one of them.
(Psalm 139:13-16 NASB)
27 Feb 15
Originally posted by RJHindsHe said she said. There is nothing in there that proves we have souls.Now the word of the Lord came to me saying,
“Before I formed you in the womb I knew you,
And before you were born I consecrated you;
I have appointed you a prophet to the nations.”
(Jeremiah 1:4-5 NASB)
For You formed my inward parts;
You wove me in my mother’s womb.
I will give thanks to You, for I am fearfully and wonderf ...[text shortened]... at were ordained for me,
When as yet there was not one of them.
(Psalm 139:13-16 NASB)
- Joined
- 31 May 06
- Moves
- 1795
27 Feb 15
Originally posted by twhiteheadAronRa [who's videos I occasionally post] had, when he was a theist a view
There is good reason to believe that we will in future be able to coax any cell to change into a stem cell.
[b]A theist would, presumably, argue that this is sufficiently close to fertilization for the soul to be added then.
In other words they would make something up? This could probably not supported it with Bible verses hence the absence of the ...[text shortened]... been able to extract that much from some theists. But which memories has been a lot more vague.[/b]
that life was infused with some kind of "Life Force" [he was heavily influenced
by Star Wars] which persisted in every living thing and continued to exist after
that thing died.
However he viewed it continuing to exist in much the same way that the atoms
in you continue to exist.
The analogy he gave is that you have a glass of water, and that water is your soul,
your life force. And you then poor that glass into the sea, and then quickly refill it.
The water in their now is a mix of what used to be in there, and new water.
Some of your soul is now back in the glass, and some is still in the ocean.
So when you die your soul or spirit lives on, but not as a contiguous entity.
Obviously this doesn't work for believers of afterlives as you need to stay as a
unique identifiable entity for that to work.
But it's a more logically coherent idea [if still ultimately factually wrong] than the
normal beliefs about souls or life force spirit energy.
27 Feb 15
Originally posted by googlefudgeIf he was thinking about setting up a religion I think that notion of soul might be quite popular. Maybe he should.
AronRa [who's videos I occasionally post] had, when he was a theist a view
that life was infused with some kind of "Life Force" [he was heavily influenced
by Star Wars] which persisted in every living thing and continued to exist after
that thing died.
However he viewed it continuing to exist in much the same way that the atoms
in you continue ...[text shortened]... l ultimately factually wrong] than the
normal beliefs about souls or life force spirit energy.
- Joined
- 31 May 06
- Moves
- 1795
27 Feb 15
1 edit
Originally posted by DeepThoughtWell as he describes his religion of the time as basically being 'Jedi' I think it already does 😉
If he was thinking about setting up a religion I think that notion of soul might be quite popular. Maybe he should.
EDIT: It also sounds very like the approach to 'souls' in the "His Dark Materials" trilogy.
27 Feb 15
Originally posted by googlefudgeYour description thus far doesn't really say anything much about this 'soul' concept other than that there is something that connects a living thing to something after it dies that isn't physical. Without more description there is not much one can say about it.
But it's a more logically coherent idea [if still ultimately factually wrong] than the
normal beliefs about souls or life force spirit energy.
I would argue that it would still suffer from some of the issues with the other 'soul concepts' such as the question of what constitutes life. What types of chemical reaction are 'life' (and thus have souls) and what aren't, and when does a life form die (and thus its soul leave it). If you take the nucleus out of a cell, is it dead yet? Is the souls split in two?
Originally posted by OdBodIf there is no soul..........then there is no life and that means there is no person.
Scenario: A person dies and some of his cells have been preserved. A clone is grown from them. Does the original soul return to be with the new organism, or does a new one develop with[out the process of sexual union?
Do people actually believe that life is the body.
The soul is the true living principle which animates the body to live.
When you put a glove on your hand, ...............is the glove now alive?
No the glove is not alive ............but it is animated by the hand to mimic life.
THE BODY IS DEAD MATTER.....................but it is animated to live by the eternal living soul within.
YOU ARE AN ETERNAL LIVING BEING..................which is unborn and never dies.
The soul is trapped in the material world of [birth, disease, old age and death.]
Whilst incarnating in a material body, you have been born and have died .......hundreds of thousands of times, and you shall continue to do this until you develop true and pure love for God.
This can only be achieved by embracing true spirituality and rejecting mundane false religion.