Works-Based and Faith-Based Salvation

Originally posted by @rajk999
There is nothing in the Bible called works-based or faith-based salvation. These are expressions used by certain Christians , in an attempt to belittle the teachings of Christ and the Apostles pertaining to good works and righteousness.

There is only one salvation and one eternal life in the Kingdom of God, and this is obtained by following the commandme ...[text shortened]... eachings of Christ pertaining to good works be sidelined in favour of Pauls faith only teaching.

A little more Bible reading seems apropos here. Let us know when you manage it.

Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-duke
Wise man say, 'a person's good thoughts and good heart are evidenced primarily by their good actions.'

Let the good Samaritan be a lesson to all of us.

You are like a plumber musing on nuclear physics.

Originally posted by @rajk999
I take it you believe that you can accept Jesus and then continue to sin and still enter the Kingdom of God.

Easy on the judgement there, Solomon.

James 2 handles the subject very perfectly:

14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,

16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

You certainly do not want to be caught having dead faith, and you most certainly don't want to be a faithless person who feels justified by fulfilling the law and by doing some work, because that is just as wrong.

The Bible clearly addresses the topic and the answer is down the middle.

Let's also remember this... the works involve moral perfection and not necessarily just good works in the sense of charity.

Originally posted by @suzianne
A little more Bible reading seems apropos here. Let us know when you manage it.

Every poster in this thread is commenting on the topic. Except you (and me now).

Get the log out of your own eye.

Originally posted by @suzianne
You are like a plumber musing on nuclear physics.

Or perhaps the Bible is a leaky pipe, not a nuclear reactor.

Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-duke
Or perhaps the Bible is a leaky pipe, not a nuclear reactor.

Or perhaps Suzianne sees herself as akin to a nuclear physicist

...and you, bless your cotton socks, are like a plumber.

Originally posted by @jacob-verville
James 2 handles the subject very perfectly:

[quote]14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,

16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those thin ...[text shortened]... rks involve moral perfection and not necessarily just good works in the sense of charity.

We agree then. Faith and Works is the real thing.
Faith alone is dead.
Works is where we probably disagree.

Seeing that there are so many billions of people, we know that not everyone can manage both faith and works. The qustion is who do you think will fare better in the end? Is it someone who comes to Christ with dead faith or someone with works alone and no knowledge of God or Christ?

Originally posted by @romans1009
<Jesus did not die so that Christians can continue on with a life of sin.>

No one is saying He did.

You seem to think that people who believe they are saved by faith in Jesus Christ and nothing else go out sinning like crazy because they got their ticket punched to heaven. Nothing could be further from the truth, and anyone who did that would n ...[text shortened]... ef and don’t feel like repeating them again since all but one were not addressed the first time.[/b]

Long talk is not my thing, so I would not address all your points.

Show me in the Bible where the professed Christian can continue sinning [as you have repeatedly said you do], and be repeatedly forgiven.

Originally posted by @fmf
Or perhaps Suzianne sees herself as akin to a nuclear physicist

...and you, bless your cotton socks, are like a plumber.

If you have a leaky tap sir, i'm the man to contact.

Originally posted by @rajk999
Long talk is not my thing, so I would not address all your points.

Show me in the Bible where the professed Christian can continue sinning [as you have repeatedly said you do], and be repeatedly forgiven.

“But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.“

(1 John 1:7-10)

Originally posted by @rajk999
We agree then. Faith and Works is the real thing.
Faith alone is dead.
Works is where we probably disagree.

Seeing that there are so many billions of people, we know that not everyone can manage both faith and works. The qustion is who do you think will fare better in the end? Is it someone who comes to Christ with dead faith or someone with works alone and no knowledge of God or Christ?

What proves that salvation by faith plus works is false is the dispensation of someone who comes to saving faith in Jesus Christ and dies a very short time later, before he has the opportunity to do any good works, as the thief on the cross did.

Originally posted by @romans1009
“But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness ...[text shortened]... say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.“

(1 John 1:7-10)

The flaw here is that if they continue to sin, they don't " walk in the light, as he is in the light". They may be trying to do so, but the fact is that they don't.

It isn't until after they are able to " walk in the light, as he is in the light" that they are forgiven.

Originally posted by @rajk999
I dont believe what I want. I believe what the Bible has. Regarding Jesus shedding of blood:
- it is shed for the sins of the whole world
- it is shed so that people can avoid the blood sacrifice for their sins
- after accepting Christ people are cleansed of their sins
- then they should continue to live as Jesus commanded
- failure to do this leads to ...[text shortened]... le eternal damnation

Jesus did not die so that Christians can continue on with a life of sin.

"Jesus did not die so that Christians can continue on with a life of sin".

So why don't you tell me something that every Christian doesn't already know?

Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-duke
If you have a leaky tap sir, i'm the man to contact.

Thanks, but it's my reactor core that's leaking.